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What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

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Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#101

Post by Aachen »

esperent wrote: post #90
grandmczeb wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your example is interesting because in retrospect Super Size Me was alarmist and unfair. Morgan Spurlock mislead viewers to believe that his health conditions were caused by McDonalds when they were in fact caused by alcoholism. https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-big-mac-attack-or-a-false-ala...

Are you claiming that the Social Dilemma was likewise alarmist and unfair?

I think what they're "claiming" is that it's worth considering whether that's the case here as well without picking a particular side yet.

Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#102

Post by mgkimsal »

bot41 wrote: post #100

I think this is a pretty good response. My only issue with it is: "The overwhelming majority of content that people see on Facebook is not polarizing or even political—it’s everyday content from people’s friends and family." When I used FB I didn't find it polarizing or political but I did find I couldn't see content from people I knew. Other pages and crap overtook it and filled my feed. It was essentially useless t…

> The overwhelming majority of content that people see on Facebook is not polarizing or even political—it’s everyday content from people’s friends and family

This seems like it's totally dependent on the politicalness of your friends and family. The past few months, many of my friends and family have been overtly political on facebook, and I ended up seeing it. I don't think that's easily avoided in a contentious election season.

I made an attempt at stopping using facebook about 3 weeks ago, and have been successful so far. Then I just learned another family member joined and I'd like to connect. With my family spread out so far, it's one of the few ways most of us can stay connected. So... I'll probably be back in the FB world small doses in the next week.

That said, I didn't find leaving all that liberating. Some people talk of some sort of new found freedom after stopping using facebook, but I didn't feel that way. I just have a bit of extra time during the week, which I've mostly filled with phone calls to other people, so there's probably not a huge net win from a time perspective. There may be some benefits re: privacy/data collection, but I've been on it for ... 11 years at this point. I'm not sure a few weeks off makes much of a difference yet. :)

Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#103

Post by searchableguy »

jtwaleson wrote: post #50

Yesterday I watched The Social Dilemma, and I just wanted to share some of my experiences: I quit FB as a user in 2011. In 2013, when I was 25, I received a high paying job offer to work at FB. Going to SV was a long-time dream, but in the end I took the hard decision not to take the offer. Ultimately I really don't like what FB does. The perks and salary don't compensate for that. I'm still on HN, LinkedIn and Whats…

> I'm very worried about how my kids will be able to handle it in their teens.

The biggest factor after education would be the ability to be non conformist. That requires you have some leverage in the group. If you don't, you will quickly become target for exclusion and bullying.

In school, it's not easy to avoid bad apples and many parents are/will be negligent. So you will have few students using social media and trying to influence others into it even if the current situation changes.

Teens also want to prove themselves and the dynamics of social media provides cheap validation. You need intrinsic motivation about something to fight it as well as support or acknowledgement from adults.

Recommended resource: https://www.privacytools.io/

Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#104

Post by prepend »

I was surprised this is a pdf, but now wonder if they did that to reduce tracking of readership and sharing.

If so, that’s a positive thing for them. A pdf doesn’t have the Facebook like tracking and shadow tracking. They can still see some traffic from the raw http gets, but it skips the ubiquitous Facebook analytics that the documentary talks about.

Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#106

Post by 082349872349872 »

tr352 wrote: post #93
082349872349872 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is "you are the product" incorrect? Facebook's customers buy eyeballs, so how are eyeballs not the product? Compare the parallel logic of "steers are not the product: this ranch is funded by meat buyers so it remains free for cattle." Go da we da peyeting. (follow the money)

> How is "you are the product" incorrect? I think the point is not that this statement is incorrect, but rather that it doesn’t accurately convey the severity of the situation. More accurate would be: “manipulation of their audience is their product”.

One of the nice touches in "Gravy Planet" (1952) are the throwaway sentences that show, via revealed preferences, how the ad-exec protagonist is also a product of the system he helped create.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24576623

====

Manipulation of the audience in pre-TV days, ca. fourth century BC:

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:19...

> "The emotions are all those affections which cause men to change their opinion in regard to their judgements"

Remember the Maine!

Re: What “The Social Dilemma” Gets Wrong [pdf]

#107

Post by [deleted] »

tr352 wrote: post #93
082349872349872 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is "you are the product" incorrect? Facebook's customers buy eyeballs, so how are eyeballs not the product? Compare the parallel logic of "steers are not the product: this ranch is funded by meat buyers so it remains free for cattle." Go da we da peyeting. (follow the money)

> How is "you are the product" incorrect? I think the point is not that this statement is incorrect, but rather that it doesn’t accurately convey the severity of the situation. More accurate would be: “manipulation of their audience is their product”.

[deleted]
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