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Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

politico.eu

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Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#101

Post by Yetanfou »

dsign wrote: post #10

Let's see how that goes. Everybody in Sweden right now has an uneasy feeling about Amazon, and I have the impression that if people could have a referendum on the matter, Amazon wouldn't be allowed in.

Everybody in Sweden is ~10.150.000 people. They all have their own ideas about many things, including whether Amazon should be allowed to set up shop here. I thing they should be allowed, that does not mean I want them to take over the market. Since my opinion represents that of 0.00001% of the population I'm not going to speak for the rest of the country.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#102

Post by Yetanfou »

username90 wrote: post #98
guerrilla wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Swedish naiveté always amazes me.

Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds. Their friends and family are working class. If they do something that is bad for the working class it will ruin their social lives, so they wont. And since the working/lower middle class is the biggest class they have no problems getting elected. This is how democracy is supposed to work.

> Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds

Have you looked at the current Swedish government? You'll be hard pressed to find people with "working class backgrounds" there, they're mostly political broilers who started their career in the SSU (social democrat youth movement) or Grön Ungdom (environmental party youth movement). Stefan Löfven is one of the few who at least made a start torwards becoming a worker in that he was training to become a welder before he became a full-time labour union representative followed by a career in the SAP (social democratic worker's party).

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#103

Post by Yetanfou »

Jolter wrote: post #84
guerrilla wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Swedish naiveté always amazes me.

Feel free to explain a plausible scenario where Amazon wins an all-out fight with the unions, then.

Very simple, they'll just stage most operations outside of Sweden but inside the EU and run deliveries to Sweden that way. More or less like things are now, really.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#104

Post by guerrilla »

username90 wrote: post #98
guerrilla wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Swedish naiveté always amazes me.

Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds. Their friends and family are working class. If they do something that is bad for the working class it will ruin their social lives, so they wont. And since the working/lower middle class is the biggest class they have no problems getting elected. This is how democracy is supposed to work.

a) Once they get elected, they're no longer working class. You're making the same mistake Lenin's followers did but on a smaller scale. b) They can manipulate an entrte country of strangers to get elected but not the people over whom they have an information advantage and other more direct sources of power (including rewards)? Think it through a bit more.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#105

Post by Jolter »

Yetanfou wrote: post #103
Jolter wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feel free to explain a plausible scenario where Amazon wins an all-out fight with the unions, then.

Very simple, they'll just stage most operations outside of Sweden but inside the EU and run deliveries to Sweden that way. More or less like things are now, really.

I don’t see how they will win the marketplace then. Delivery will be slower than their local competitors, presumably.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#106

Post by Jolter »

encom wrote: post #96
Jolter wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has any "yellow" union been formed yet, though? Link?

Yes, there are plenty of them. Just off the top of my head there are Krifa, Det Faglige Hus, Frie Funktionærer and some others that I've forgotten. They are bloodsucking leeches, benefiting from the work done by real proper unions, and their members are rightfully shunned in some workplaces.

Ok I meant in Sweden, sorry for not being clearer. I misunderstood the GP comment.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#107

Post by username90 »

guerrilla wrote: post #104
username90 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds. Their friends and family are working class. If they do something that is bad for the working class it will ruin their social lives, so they wont. And since the working/lower middle class is the biggest class they have no problems getting elected. This is how democracy is supposed to work.

a) Once they get elected, they're no longer working class. You're making the same mistake Lenin's followers did but on a smaller scale. b) They can manipulate an entrte country of strangers to get elected but not the people over whom they have an information advantage and other more direct sources of power (including rewards)? Think it through a bit more.

> Once they get elected, they're no longer working class.

Not exactly, your class is as much determined by your friends and family as your job. People with a background in Ivy leagues, law school or wealthy parents like basically all American politicians don't have many or even any working class friends so face no peer pressure to protect working class people.

> They can manipulate an entrte country of strangers to get elected but not the people over whom they have an information advantage and other more direct sources of power (including rewards)?

They didn't manipulate people to get elected, they got elected since they represent the people well. They can't give rewards to their friends and family or it would be a scandal, Sweden has very little tolerance of corruption. Simple things like buying groceries with tax money instead of their salary or creating hard to find job postings to get friends into jobs creates headlines and has forced people to resign.

Politicians can't be shittier than you let them be. If you tolerate corrupt behavior you will get corrupt behavior. If you don't then they will conform since they don't want to lose their positions.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#108

Post by username90 »

Yetanfou wrote: post #102
username90 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds. Their friends and family are working class. If they do something that is bad for the working class it will ruin their social lives, so they wont. And since the working/lower middle class is the biggest class they have no problems getting elected. This is how democracy is supposed to work.

> Unlike USA Swedish politicians mostly comes from working class backgrounds Have you looked at the current Swedish government? You'll be hard pressed to find people with "working class backgrounds" there, they're mostly political broilers who started their career in the SSU (social democrat youth movement) or Grön Ungdom (environmental party youth movement). Stefan Löfven is one of the few who at least made a start…

How many of them have college degrees? How many of them have parents that had college degrees? How many of them got a lot of money from their parents?

I'd say that most of our politicians don't have any of those. They might be career politicians, but if they didn't become politicians they would have had a working class career. You can't say the same for many American politicians.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#109

Post by Yetanfou »

Jolter wrote: post #105
Yetanfou wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very simple, they'll just stage most operations outside of Sweden but inside the EU and run deliveries to Sweden that way. More or less like things are now, really.

I don’t see how they will win the marketplace then. Delivery will be slower than their local competitors, presumably.

You'd think so, wouldn't you? In practice I've had parcels from Germany arrive a week before those which were ordered from Swedish companies on the same day. It even happened once with a shipment from China which arrived in a record 7 days while the Swedish shipment lingered in a postal depot for 3 more days. This was back in the time the Swedish postal monopoly still drove yellow trucks and cars and had not merged yet with the Danish equivalent, i.e. before things went downhill.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#110

Post by guerrilla »

username90 wrote: post #107
guerrilla wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a) Once they get elected, they're no longer working class. You're making the same mistake Lenin's followers did but on a smaller scale. b) They can manipulate an entrte country of strangers to get elected but not the people over whom they have an information advantage and other more direct sources of power (including rewards)? Think it through a bit more.

> Once they get elected, they're no longer working class. Not exactly, your class is as much determined by your friends and family as your job. People with a background in Ivy leagues, law school or wealthy parents like basically all American politicians don't have many or even any working class friends so face no peer pressure to protect working class people. > They can manipulate an entrte country of strangers to g…

Class is determined by how much property you own and how much power you have. You're talking about culture and relationships. Many millionaires have poor freinds and that doesn't change the class of either.

Just "lol" to the rest.

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