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Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

jvns.ca

101–110 of 161 posts

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I've experienced a lot of number fiddling to describe total comp. For example we offer you X equity at Y valuation, when the valuation is something they have made up internally etc. I want to know how much cash in hand I can expect. Also, offering private health insurance, when you live in a country with a decent public health care system is not much of benefit and generally not worth what the company says it…

Startups are going to be like that, but you said you were interviewing at AWS. You can buy and sell their equity on the open market, so it's not really a mystery what you're getting. If they say they give you 50 shares a year, that's $137,941 a year in cash money. Probably more next year. You can sell it or hold it, but turning it into cash is very easy. Sure, Amazon could go out of business while you're holding stoc…

Instead of worrying about base salary vs. equity, I'd rather know roughly how much "guaranteed" compensation to expect. Guaranteed would include cash salary, immediately-sellable stock, and the amount of bonus that is not contingent on personal or company performance. The rest is "speculative" compensation: stock options, potential gains from holding stock, illiquid stock, and bonuses that might not materialize for various reasons.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#102
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> An interviewer should be ready and willing to provide feedback if the candidate signals that it would be welcome. And at which point would this happen, I wonder? All the interviews I went through during the last 4 months didn't have one person sound inviting along the lines of "we won't take you but if you think we can improve our process do let us know". Not one even hinted at that. It's all very... impersonal, co…

Sorry to hear about your experiences. It sounds frustrating. I think there's some miscommunication happening here. The line you quoted is specifically regarding the person conducting the interview looking for signals to provide feedback to the person being interviewed, not the other way around. I would not recommend providing feedback to your interviewer unless they explicitly ask for it. It's likely to just become a…

Oops, I guess I misread indeed. And you are quite right on your last paragraph -- found it the hard way.

I also agree that the interviewer shouldn't just give feedback without asking because I know many interviewees will react badly.

It's just that in my case no feedback was wanted in either direction. And job-hunting is a game of numbers and evolution (okay, most of the time, definitely not always): you seek to adapt to the current conditions and see what you can improve upon for the next interview. Some feedback would have made your time and effort worth it. Giving you zero feedback wastes your time entirely though.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is strongly misaligned with many companies' incentives so it will never happen, I am afraid. A lot of interviewing processes are kind of like fishing. They hope that if they wasted you 6-10 hours of your time before an actual offer then you'd make a decision based on the sunk cost fallacy ("not sure how much time the other companies will waste me, let's take this one on their offer, it's not so bad"). I am glad…

The solution is to make companies pay people for their time during interviews, at an hourly rate equivalent to compensation for the position. Everyone else in the interview is getting paid by the company, after all. Suddenly, managers, hiring committees, and recruiters will stop wasting people’s time and everyone will know what to expect to get paid!

I'd love that but I am pretty sure it won't ever happen.

A compromising variant I found is to make public the GitHub repos where I did homework assignments, with the company name removed and with the README enriched to clearly explain what was the task and how was it successfully done (although I do that preliminarily regardless).

At one point 4 companies told me that they actually went through my accumulated interview assignments in GitHub and liked them and wanted a HR/manager interview without the tech interview before, which was a pleasant surprise.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"If you can't go without breaks in a 7h day, you are not good enough to work here" even worse when you think it's really saying "if you can't go without breaks in a 7h day of meetings"

It is even worse when it is legally required for employer to allow for an hour break after every 4 working hours. Edit: It is at least where I live. (EU)

In the UK at least, it's not this generous, even with the legislation from the EU working time directive. What country are you in?

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#105
post #99

How about telling candidates why they were rejected?

I presume it's a liability thing. It only takes one candidate to "spin" an otherwise valid reason into something they can sue for. Same reason why companies don't tell employees what they're being let go for in at-will states.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#106
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is strongly misaligned with many companies' incentives so it will never happen, I am afraid. A lot of interviewing processes are kind of like fishing. They hope that if they wasted you 6-10 hours of your time before an actual offer then you'd make a decision based on the sunk cost fallacy ("not sure how much time the other companies will waste me, let's take this one on their offer, it's not so bad"). I am glad…

>They hope that if they wasted you 6-10 hours of your time before an actual offer then you'd make a decision based on the sunk cost fallacy You might be overthinking this. I doubt many companies really have this viewpoint for the simple fact that falling for this is a trait of a bad employee. You don't want to actively select your employees based on their flawed decision making process.

I definitely could be overthinking it and I said the part you quoted kind of out of spite as well.

But there are bad employers out there, be sure of it. Some of them definitely do employ that tactic. Might be unconsciously but they do.

They definitely lack the self-awareness to know what does it mean to hire a bad employee. They kind of just go through the motions.

One skill I never wanted to have but gradually developed pretty well was to recognize early such employers and bail out.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#107

All of that sounds like you’re just going to favor people who are slacking at their current work, unemployed or have a ton of free time outside of work to prepare. How is that “leveling the playing field”? Obviously if you’re google or whatever your process is going to leak anyway so better to tell candidate upfront what to expect (and they do). If you’re smaller/unknown co may as well get genuine reaction rather tha…

I disagree. I've interviewed an abnormal amount: roughly every 8 months since getting my first job, and for more than one job at a time.[0]

Based on my experience, the best interviews have been the ones with the most detail shared up-front. When I say best, I don't just mean my own performance has been best, but I also feel that the interviewer has been most satisfied and that they have learned what they meant to learn.

The reasons for this are several-fold. In order to prepare a candidate well, there must be a well-structured interview process. This means that each interview should have some explicit goals - information about the candidate which the interviewer intends to elicit.

It is painful for everyone and a waste of time for the goal of an interview to be unclear to one party (and many times so if the goal is unclear to both). My favorite interviews have been at several FAANGs, which were highly structured. I knew up front what the interviewers would be looking for in broad strokes, and how the interviews would be structured to elicit that information. I knew how technical acumen would be ascertained.

I much prefer this over walking into a room with no idea what will happen. I do very well in those interviews as well, as I have spent much of my career in professional services, where part of my job description is to be always ready to project competence and to rapidly build rapport with new clients and potential clients. I also have much experience in interviewing to lean upon. Nevertheless, this is still a worse interview process, as I have to spend time figuring out what the interviewer needs to learn.

You may object that a good interviewer should be able to guide the interviewee. This is correct on the face of things. However, any people are bad interviewers, because there is rarely much training or prep for them. I have had plenty of successful interviews where I have had to lead the interviewer, rather than the other way around.

Additionally, there are very few jobs where job requirements include being quick on your feet and being able to rapidly (aka within an hour or so) ascertain what someone needs and how to give it to them. If you are looking to fill such a position, no-prep "genuine reaction" interviews might be a good fit. If, on the other hand, the position requires analytical thought and deliberation over periods of time greater than an hour (or whatever the length of your interview is), then such a no-prep interview seems a poor method to learn whether the interviewee has the skills you are looking for.

All this said, I do not like interview processes that have large homework requirements. It is one thing to inform the candidate of the structure and broad content of the interview, but another thing entirely to request that they do extensive work. My most extensive interview prep (excluding homework assignments) has never been more than a few hours, even for FAANG interviews with much structure and lots of prep materials shared by the company. If you can't find a few hours to prep for interviews, you're probably not taking them very seriously. And if you can't fit two or three hours of prep into a period of one to two weeks, then you've got bigger problems in your life.

[0] Note I haven't changed jobs this frequently, but I've always kept an eye out for interesting opportunities. I would interview companies to see if I like them or their job offer. I would frequently bail out early if it didn't seem like a good fit. Some I went for offers and used that to negotiate. Some I went for offers just to learn what comp packages look like. Some I went for offers to get the job.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is strongly misaligned with many companies' incentives so it will never happen, I am afraid. A lot of interviewing processes are kind of like fishing. They hope that if they wasted you 6-10 hours of your time before an actual offer then you'd make a decision based on the sunk cost fallacy ("not sure how much time the other companies will waste me, let's take this one on their offer, it's not so bad"). I am glad…

Goes both ways. I make a point of working at well-funded tech companies and if a recruiter neglects to raise salary from the get-go I use it to my advantage to make them and the hiring manager squirm as they re-arrange the department budget to pay me an extra 20%+ over the initial offer. As you mentioned, time is money :) and interviewing sucks even more after you find the right candidate.

True true, and I mostly did the same this time around. But the pandemic thinned my savings much earlier than I anticipated (I should have been able to coast on them all the way to Christmas) so at one point I was forced to play the numbers game -- while ignoring obvious bad signs -- much more than I wanted.

Lessons learned though. I quickly started putting very steep conditions on the table in response to employers whose conditions I had reservations about. It worked. 99% bailed out, only 2 agreed with my conditions. But by then I had much better offers overall so it didn't help them.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#109

Also get feedback from candidates, especially rejected ones. The people who get offers will assume that the process works, since it validates their self-worth. Even if the process is very stupid. I've had processes that were so so bad from top companies. Like "here's a repo, clone it, write a program that will be judged by automated tests that you can't see". I had to basically guess what the tests were going to do,…

I think it's instructive to look at this from the other side to see why these processes exist. At my last job, I wanted to hire a frontend engineer with some experience beyond tweaking HTML and CSS (we used gRPC/Web and Typescript, so some actual programming experience was going to make them pretty productive, and that's what I was looking for). Anyway, I wrote up a req and posted it to the usual career sites, and wi…

I 100% agree. I used to be in the boat of "I shouldn't have to study to pass a job interview" when I was younger.

Now that I'm older and I've interviewed a lot of people too, I realize sometimes life is un-fun and kinda sucks but you gotta do what you gotta do. There's a strong co-relation between people who spend two hours a night for three months studying algorithm questions and people who are willing to spend 8 hours a day debugging un-fun code. Which, more often than not, is what I need my team mates to do.

I work in AdTech. It's not particularly sexy. We don't have particularly sexy projects but we do have a large (millions of users per day) scale. A lot of our projects just require a engineer who has base level of experience plus a positive attitude and a slightly above average level of responsibility because we have to avoid outages. I need people to do work that is oftentimes not particularly fun but particularly important and revenue driving. My best filter, apart from actually having worked with the person for years beforehand, is asking a low-ball JavaScript "can you debug this asynchronous JavaScript" question.

So while the current system is frustrating, until we can figure out a best solution, unfortunately you just gotta play the game how the rules are laid out now.

Re: Tell candidates what to expect from your job interviews

#110
post #99

How about telling candidates why they were rejected?

I've had some surprisingly good feedback experiences in recent interviews.

One was at a 40,000-employee global tech professional services firm. I got feedback from each interviewer filtered through the recruiter at each step along the way, sharing both positive and negative. This process ended in an offer I didn't accept.

Another recent interview process at a FAANG ended in a rejection. The recruiter followed up with me and informed me which interviews were considered a pass and which were a fail. Each interview had several components, and the recruiter was able to tell me which components were the cause of failure in the one interview, and what to focus on in any future applications to the company.

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