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Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

garron.blog

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Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#101

Post by eeZah7Ux »

codegeek wrote: post #29
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What percentage of city bus riders or public restaurant visitors do you think use the wheelchair ramp?

In my opinion, that is not a fair comparison. Wheelchair ramp usage percentage may be small but they are built because of laws and helps people who actually need it. People are not disabled by choice. Javascript disablers (and I have full sympathy as a dev. myself) are doing it by choice which is totally fine but it is still a choice, not a need.

A lot of visually-impared users have to disable javascript to minimize pop-ups to use a braille terminal.

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#102

Post by Shared404 »

tartoran wrote: post #78
maest wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're probably aware, but just in case: old.reddit.com gives the old (js-free) interface.

That until the old reddit is deprecated. They want people to go ahead use the new interface because it makes it much easier to insert ads, track and do who knows what kind of other shenanigans.. The thing is for us who've known a better and more usable internet, we have something to compare it to and simply say no. The newer generation of users accept it for what it is, they don't know better. Something else irks me…

> The newer generation of users accept it for what it is, they don't know better.

Not all of us

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#103

Post by chosenbreed37 »

boring_twenties wrote: post #91
aaomidi wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More so it's not configured to do that - which depends on the priority of the team working on it.

Well that's true for anything, so it means nothing. I know someone who was told with a straight face, in a meeting about an out of control memory leak in some software, "not leaking memory wasn't in the requirements."

LOL! That must have been some poker face! Unbelievable!

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#104

Post by WrtCdEvrydy »

boring_twenties wrote: post #91
aaomidi wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More so it's not configured to do that - which depends on the priority of the team working on it.

Well that's true for anything, so it means nothing. I know someone who was told with a straight face, in a meeting about an out of control memory leak in some software, "not leaking memory wasn't in the requirements."

I mean, they're not wrong, but I've handled that stupidity by making sure my next requirements included "Do not have sexual intercourse with your coworkers" and "Be a professional software engineer"

Edit: It's kinda like the story of the guy on the ship who was forced to write accurate logs and wrote "The captain was not drunk today"

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#105

Post by errantspark »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #60
errantspark wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ahahaha come on my guy, effective people get to where they are because they can make good risk/reward assessments. Turning off javascript hasn't been worth the opportunity cost to a "real professional" for decades.

> because they can make good risk/reward assessments Indeed, and I made mine. No ads, not tracking, no risk of malware, no need for virus scanner, high speed page loading (ahem, when it works). Worth it? For me, sure! Peace of mind means a lot to me. What's so hard about making web pages that don't use unnecessary tech?

There's nothing wrong with it, I AGREE with you that we shouldn't ship 5 megs of some garbage framework with every blog post. The point I'm responding to is that it's somehow reasonable or common for "professionals" to run with JS off, and to not do so is "playing around". It's not. It's a very niche thing that very few people get an actual benefit from.

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#106

Post by errantspark »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #66
errantspark wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ahahaha come on my guy, effective people get to where they are because they can make good risk/reward assessments. Turning off javascript hasn't been worth the opportunity cost to a "real professional" for decades.

Security researchers and activists in oppressive regimes are professionals. And it's amazing how fast one can end up becoming one when your employer gets badly hacked or your government changes for the worse.

I'm not saying there's no reason to turn off javascript, or that there aren't professions where that's a good default. But it's absolutely not the norm.

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#107

Post by aaomidi »

boring_twenties wrote: post #91
aaomidi wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More so it's not configured to do that - which depends on the priority of the team working on it.

Well that's true for anything, so it means nothing. I know someone who was told with a straight face, in a meeting about an out of control memory leak in some software, "not leaking memory wasn't in the requirements."

And leaking memory is actually a valid tactic when you're writing software for financial systems that have scheduled times to turn off.

In various HFTFs GC is completely disabled since that valuable cpu time is useful for other things.

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#109

Post by lazyjones »

mdoms wrote: post #12

I absolutely agree that JS is over-used, but for anything other than very static content I generally am not interested in kowtowing to the strict "no JS" folks. Javascript has become a fundamental part of the web, and for the same reason I won't put in extra work to make my sites work in IE, I also will not put in extra work to make my sites work for (a vanishingly small number of) people who pre-emptively block one…

> Javascript has become a fundamental part of the web, and for the same reason I won't put in extra work to make my sites work in IE, I also will not put in extra work to make my sites work for (a vanishingly small number of) people who pre-emptively block one of the most powerful tools in my belt.

Perhaps you should just try without JS one day and you might be relieved off a large burden that comes with JS (a lot of security issues, complexity, organizing files and loading, crawling and indexing support). I think the threshold for switching to JS use should be higher than it is currently for all the people who just use it by default.

Re: Create No-JavaScript friendly sites

#110

Post by lazyjones »

eeZah7Ux wrote: post #101
codegeek wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion, that is not a fair comparison. Wheelchair ramp usage percentage may be small but they are built because of laws and helps people who actually need it. People are not disabled by choice. Javascript disablers (and I have full sympathy as a dev. myself) are doing it by choice which is totally fine but it is still a choice, not a need.

A lot of visually-impared users have to disable javascript to minimize pop-ups to use a braille terminal.

Don't expect typical web developers to care for 1-2% blind users when they've often ignored browsers with 5% or higher market share... Most don't understand that a one-time effort to get the last few % in revenue is worth it.
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