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US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

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Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#101

Post by testbot123 »

corrupt_measure wrote: post #70
majormajor wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which was a terrible thing to because it harms the community and their own cause as it makes them look like thugs and villains. > And there have indeed been many taking advantage of the situation to steak and cause chaos for chaos' sake. Violence, as well as hangars-on who are just there for the violence, have been part of anti-state, anti-abuse-of-power protests since time immemorial. The only people who think it…

That sounds nice to radicals and perhaps functions well as something they tell themselves to excuse violent tendencies, but in reality it just disgusts the vast majority of law abiding people, as is the case with the current protests. Public opinion is quickly turning from sympathy to disgust.

You realize that radicals and those protesting are part of the "public", right? That their expression of grievances are part of "public opinion"?

As for the people who are disgusted? Nobody cares. They're apologists for state violence, and if after all this time they still don't understand why things are unfolding the way they are, they're only a roadblock to progress.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#102

Post by thatcat »

joshmn wrote: post #3

Native Minnesotan here — living in Minneapolis — that has lived on both coasts: With all that's happening the last few days, please don't generally associate Minnesotans with the violent riots that have captured the attention of everyone. The peacefulness of the protests and gatherings has been overshadowed by the violence. There are countless examples of Minnesotans standing up to those who choose to loot and destro…

>edge-cases

This is what happens when you dismiss edge cases in systems that are critical. Law isn't some shitty web app that can afford to just go offline.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#103

Post by TallGuyShort »

wafn wrote: post #35

Pretty sure there are laws against mass arson, looting, rioting, vandalism, etc. so if the people can't follow laws why should the government?

Preserving the rule of law is one of the most fundamental reasons for government to even exist. It's predicated upon the idea that sometimes people break the law, and it's better for there to be due process administered by a judicial system than for there to be anarchy. If this is going to become a people vs. the government type issue, where the government isn't expected to be any better than looters, then the looters just got even more of my sympathy than they had before.

If the government is allowed to throw out the law at this point because people are rioting in response to delayed charges against a police killing caught on video, why did the government even have to exist in the first place?

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#104

Post by testbot123 »

nickff wrote: post #36
49531 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, also the fact that a police station is filled with armed police might also be a reason.

So the rioters are hurting their fellow innocents because it's easy and less risky than going after the guilty? You're probably right, but it's not a flattering view of the rioters.

> hurting their fellow innocents

Are you talking about property damage, or actual violence like police killing unarmed black folks?

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#105

Post by evanlivingston »

mythrwy wrote: post #83
pm90 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow HN user, I welcome you with warmth so please don't take what I say offensively, but as a different perspective. > What happened is awful. It doesn't reflect how genuinely kind people in Minnesota are and how we, collectively feel about what happened and the movement at large. There will always be edge-cases as there is with any situation in any context. But for everyone that I've known, for everyone I've met a…

The anger is justified. Protests are justified. Maybe even violent protests, if not justified, are understandable. Looting and burning unrelated businesses have no justification whatsoever.

This comments reads as "god save capitalism. Everything is justified unless dollars are burned in the process."

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#106

Post by daeken »

king_magic wrote: post #100
daeken wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Edit: the law defines the boundaries of what is acceptable outrage and what isn't. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Disobedience_(Thoreau) "[i]t is not desirable to cultivate a respect for the law, so much as for the right. The only obligation which I have a right to assume is to do at any time what I think right.... Law never made men a whit more just; and, by means of their respect for it, even the well-dispos…

> If that Target is only in the neighborhood because it's an experimental LP store put in an incredibly impoverished area so that they can develop better techniques for putting people of color in prison, is it suddenly reasonable? That's a pretty absurd, carefully crafted hypothetical situation that does not apply here. > .... Yes it does. That's literally why that Target was there. Did you read the link? Edit: alrig…

.... Yes it does. That's literally why that Target was there. Did you read the link?

ETA:

> I'm simply not going to go firebomb it because I don't like it. There are plenty of things I really don't like. Do I firebomb them because I don't like them? Nope, I choose not to firebomb them. Because that's not something responsible citizens do, at least in my worldview.

I'm very, very glad that you and I have a voice in our communities/countries and don't need to resort to violence to get our message across. I'm not glad that the reason you and I have a voice and the people rioting in MN right now do not, is because we benefit from state violence and they are on the receiving end of it.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#107

Post by armitron »

jorblumesea wrote: post #86
armitron wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be absolutely honest. Who the President may be at any moment in time is totally irrelevant in US being (not becoming, it's already there) an authoritarian police state.

> Who the President may be at any moment in time is totally irrelevant in US being This is not the case and has never been the case. Presidents have different interpretations of executive powers. Trump clearly has an extremely authoritarian take on where the President sits in our government. This is plainly obvious for everyone to see and a very non-controversial observation.

Again, the President's "take" is totally irrelevant in US being an authoritarian police state. The issue is systemic and can not be attributed to an individual or office.

I'm not an American but have lived there in the past for many years. It has always baffled me how Americans are willing to blame the left or the right instead of the system as a whole. Maybe because if they did so, they would be undermining the very foundations that their country was built on.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#108

Post by mythrwy »

evanlivingston wrote: post #105
mythrwy wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The anger is justified. Protests are justified. Maybe even violent protests, if not justified, are understandable. Looting and burning unrelated businesses have no justification whatsoever.

This comments reads as "god save capitalism. Everything is justified unless dollars are burned in the process."

More like "god save common sense and basic human decency"

WTF is the matter with people?

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#109

Post by komali2 »

corrupt_measure wrote: post #70
majormajor wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which was a terrible thing to because it harms the community and their own cause as it makes them look like thugs and villains. > And there have indeed been many taking advantage of the situation to steak and cause chaos for chaos' sake. Violence, as well as hangars-on who are just there for the violence, have been part of anti-state, anti-abuse-of-power protests since time immemorial. The only people who think it…

That sounds nice to radicals and perhaps functions well as something they tell themselves to excuse violent tendencies, but in reality it just disgusts the vast majority of law abiding people, as is the case with the current protests. Public opinion is quickly turning from sympathy to disgust.

> disgusts the vast majority of law abiding people

Speak for yourself. I'm quite happy they burned down a police station. Let DAs and cops around America take note: going forward, if you don't act decisively when a cop murders a black person, you're probably gonna lose a police station.

It's just a damn shame the cops forced the people to go this far to get the message across. The police officer standing by that let the murder happen could have prevented it, the cops at the protests could have deescalated instead of firing tear gas into crowds of peaceful protesters. The cops did a GREAT job of descalation when white armed militia turned up at the Capitol two weeks back, they're clearly capable of it. And, the DA could have chosen to have the murderer arrested straight off.

Let this then be a lesson.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#110

Post by dariusj18 »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #26
pera wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the actual name of the aircraft: https://www.ga-asi.com/predator-b

It's usually called the Reaper, to distinguish from the original Predator

That seems more sinister somehow.
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