Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s probably not worth suing someone for $14000 though.
In Canada the loser pays all legal costs.
Maybe they have the equivalent of small claims court...
Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
101–109 of 109 posts
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
They have rations to make it accessible to all, they are a poor country crippled by a long lasting embargo. Cubans are very sweet people. Their politics attempted to keep they away from american greedy companies. Just look around the caraibean region. Countries that played ball with the US are in a very bad shape, a la economic hit man and such. Cuba managed to keep the people poor but with dignity, education, health…
They are a poor country ravaged by a tyrannical regime that has lasted as long as it has because Cuba is but a slight annoyance to the US after the Cuban Missile Crisis- nothing more, nothing less. Even if there was no embargo, the Castros would still be there doing as they wish. God knows they're trying to do the same with Venezuela. EDIT: None of this means I'm pro-embargo, or into US meddling into things they have…
The suggestion that this has anything to do with tyranny or dictators is ridiculous as well. The US has a long and consistent record of supporting hideously repressive Islamist monarchies like Saudi Arabia, and it is clear that they do not actually care about democracy or freedom in practice.
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#103They need to just give her the $14k immediately and then eat it if it's a problem. Stop processing the transactions going forward or until it's sorted out, but do not steal her money. Also, I found this distasteful: "I want to clarify that Square is not experiencing a technical glitch. While I cannot speak with you about Monica's individual case, I can tell you that Square's Customer Success team spoke with Monica ye…
I agree. Unless there is an actual law telling them to hold the cash. I would let go of it. Cut out future transfers as you said. Why PayPal like companies can just steal cash like that is beyond me. They should be legally liable for the laws broken if they keep someone elses cash.
If this is an OFAC case, which anyone who’s worked for a financial institution can tell you this sounds like a dead ringer for, there is literally an actual law requiring them (both JP Morgan and Square) to withhold the funds.
None of the companies involved even actually get to keep the money IIRC as it’s eventually handed over to the US government. Everyone involved would almost certainly love to save themselves the headache and bad press of this situation if it were at all possible.
When there’s an article about PayPal, Square, or any other financial institution holding on to some person’s cash for vague, inexplicable reasons and refusing to hand it over, the reason is virtually guaranteed to be OFAC. They can’t turn over the funds and they can’t even explain why they can’t turn over the funds without someone facing potential jail time.
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#104It's beyond time to end the embargo against Cuba.
What is even the justification for the embargo at this point?
The justification is that Florida is a swing state, and full of Cuban expats who really, really hate Castro and want the embargo to continue. These expats have the ability to swing Florida's vote, and thus Presidential elections, so both parties have to give them what they want. It's a wonderful example of how the fucked-up Electoral College distorts national policy, since a large majority of Americans overall think the embargo is stupid and should end.
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
If the question is legal liability for violating sanctions, releasing the $14K could put them on the hook for much more than $14K in liability.
Not releasing can put them in violation of Canada's Foreign Extraterritorial Measures Act so they are between a rock and a hard place (particularly Foreign Extraterritorial Measures (United States) Order, 1992 https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-92-584/p... )
And Square Canada is subject to Canada's laws first, even if its parent company is subject to some other country's laws later on.
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#106The vendor claims to buy beans from a Canadian distributor. It's not immediately obvious how to get from "bought beans in Montreal, sold Coffee in Toronto" to "funds frozen for doing business with Cuba." The devil must be in the details of the embargo.
Once something gets flagged as a potential violation, it turns into a guilty until proven innocent situation. Square has much more to lose than just some bad PR or the spread on $14K so they’re fine with freezing the money until they get a clear ruling from the US regulators that could put them in a proverbially vice. The name “Havana” probably tipped off something and now it’ll be stuck like that until a high enough…
I've put everything from "erotic services" to "5kg of cocaine" in the memo fields of cheques, bank transfers, and interac e-transfers and never had an issue of any sort.
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#107And this is exactly why the US domination of the payment industry is so dangerous, why companies like mastercard/VISA need to end, and why maybe sometimes it's understandable countries like Germany or Denmark have their own card systems or prefer cash. Running all transactions through companies subject to foreign laws makes you subject to those foreign laws. And there is no reason US laws should affect e.g. a Canadia…
"countries like Germany or Denmark have their own card systems or prefer cash"?
Denmark is an almost cashless society, and the cards I have from danish banks are mastercard - is there a different card system in Germany?
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#108And this is exactly why the US domination of the payment industry is so dangerous, why companies like mastercard/VISA need to end, and why maybe sometimes it's understandable countries like Germany or Denmark have their own card systems or prefer cash. Running all transactions through companies subject to foreign laws makes you subject to those foreign laws. And there is no reason US laws should affect e.g. a Canadia…
"countries like Germany or Denmark have their own card systems or prefer cash"? Denmark is an almost cashless society, and the cards I have from danish banks are mastercard - is there a different card system in Germany?
In the past Denmark used to use Dankort, an entirely local payment system.
Often they were used in combination with MasterCard/Visa, but in local stores, only Dankort is used, and the transaction stays in Denmark
Re: Square Canada has a Cuban coffee issue
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
This was my main takeaway from the article. Call a spade a spade. "Square's Government Fear team spoke with Monica yesterday, and she now knows the reason." It's completely legitimate for a corporation to be afraid of the government, and have a team to manage risks. It's not legitimate to call stealing $14,000 of someone's money "customer success". What Square's team did was fail the customer. That's not success.
The name is what it is. How would you feel if your company went to the media and made up some nasty name for your team because the real one sounds too positive?
I think everyone should be accountable for their role. If you're on the "customer success team" but you can't help customers, that probably feels pretty bad.