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How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

nytimes.com

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Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#101

Post by fiblye »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #100
AFascistWorld wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. These "bots" are mostly spontaneous people, they are not even government-sponsored Wumao, they genuinely love China and defend it, their reason being it may have some flaws but any other country has too and is…

I don't really think that it's true though. If everything goes well, it can stay that way. Bit when things go to shit and people found out the government lied, that patriotisme can reverse quickly. Depends on the roots of doubt on your close relatives. Living in partial fear for the social credit ain't helping and realizing you live behind a firewall online is enough to grow doubts, from my point of view. Eg. See Rus…

China’s still going through massive economic growth, and it has for many young people’s entire lives. The USSR is remembered by food shortages and other various struggles.

So long as people are fed and comfortable, China won’t suddenly collapse. Any various small problems will be brushed off or silenced until they pass.

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#102

Post by dirtyid »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #100
AFascistWorld wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. These "bots" are mostly spontaneous people, they are not even government-sponsored Wumao, they genuinely love China and defend it, their reason being it may have some flaws but any other country has too and is…

I don't really think that it's true though. If everything goes well, it can stay that way. Bit when things go to shit and people found out the government lied, that patriotisme can reverse quickly. Depends on the roots of doubt on your close relatives. Living in partial fear for the social credit ain't helping and realizing you live behind a firewall online is enough to grow doubts, from my point of view. Eg. See Rus…

>people found out the government lied, that patriotisme can reverse quickly.

Pretty much why CPC is reluctant to endorse patriotism, patriotic positions can be much more extreme than the party line - it's very hard to walk back.

>Living in partial fear for the social credit ain't helping and realizing you live behind a firewall online is enough to grow doubts

These are not really considerations for the general population. Sentiment for social credit where it's tested is positive. People like seeing financial criminals punished. They also like "civilizing" behavior modifications of mass surveillance, i.e. country bumpkins in tier3 cities stop spitting, speeding and jaywalking because they're under observation. GFW is an annoyance but easily circumvented with lax VPN rules.

>Depends on the roots of doubt on your close relatives.

If China is going to collapse, it's going to be due to the demographic time bomb when only-childs watch their aging parents languish because there isn't sufficient social safety net. CPC living standards goals is to "become a moderately prosperous society" where poverty is largely eliminated by 2021 and "fully developed nation" by 2049, presumably one with sufficient social services. I think they're a little behind, and time is not on their side.

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#103

Post by nitwit005 »

AFascistWorld wrote: post #38
machbio wrote: post #5

Am starting to feel this trolling is an industry (like troll farm) of its own - there are people or bots dedicated to trolling and reporting people who raise voice against the discrimination.. I recently had to report an unfair service by virgin atlantic staff after an emergency landing - I tweeted the pictures and video of the incident.. I was immediately trolled by twitter accounts about how i should be happy that…

You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. These "bots" are mostly spontaneous people, they are not even government-sponsored Wumao, they genuinely love China and defend it, their reason being it may have some flaws but any other country has too and is…

Russia and China have, in effect, trained people to assume posts defending them are paid or bots. Many of us have seen the sudden swarm of patterned posts, sometimes with bad English, show up in comments. And we've seen news articles like this one.

Maybe it works, on average, but it tends to undermine real people's posts. Why listen to someone who is likely to be a bot?

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#104

Post by jacquesm »

dragonwriter wrote: post #89
freeflight wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. This has been a common theme with this "Fake News and Social Bots" stuff since the very beginning not reserved to China. On the 34C3 there was a really interesting talk [0] about the troublesome nature of cl…

> You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. Is that what they actually feel, or is that exactly the upper limit of what the State accepts as legitimate dissatisfaction with the status quo, which the vast majority of people are aware of an unwilling to…

I've lived in a place like that. Communist Poland, 1985/1986. It was pretty weird. Inlaws, very well to do by Polish standards were continuously reminding their twenty something daughter that she should keep out of that because 'names were being recorded' and nothing good would ever come out of it. Never mind the details of Zomo's beating up people in the streets, it was their own reputation they were scared of. They looked pretty silly for a while when the wall fell, but then all their connections landed on their feet and made bank, and nothing really changed for a long time. By now it fortunately has changed, but still, lots of the fat cats from before the wall fell are much fatter still today.

The amount of legitimate dissatisifaction is proportionally inverse to people's general well being and with China having made very rapid progress on that front you can bet that people are in principle quite satisfied with their leadership.

If it stagnates for too long or crashes then things will change. The dissidents are not even a blip on the radar until the economy goes haywire, then they will matter.

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#105

Post by swiley »

machbio wrote: post #5

Am starting to feel this trolling is an industry (like troll farm) of its own - there are people or bots dedicated to trolling and reporting people who raise voice against the discrimination.. I recently had to report an unfair service by virgin atlantic staff after an emergency landing - I tweeted the pictures and video of the incident.. I was immediately trolled by twitter accounts about how i should be happy that…

Last summer I remember a coworker telling me he was writting bots to counteract what he belived to be bots employed by republican polititions. I already felt like the signal to noise ratio on twitter had gotten pretty bad but at that point I realised there isn't enough left to ever justify exposing myself to it again.

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#106

Post by tomp »

AFascistWorld wrote: post #38
machbio wrote: post #5

Am starting to feel this trolling is an industry (like troll farm) of its own - there are people or bots dedicated to trolling and reporting people who raise voice against the discrimination.. I recently had to report an unfair service by virgin atlantic staff after an emergency landing - I tweeted the pictures and video of the incident.. I was immediately trolled by twitter accounts about how i should be happy that…

You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. These "bots" are mostly spontaneous people, they are not even government-sponsored Wumao, they genuinely love China and defend it, their reason being it may have some flaws but any other country has too and is…

How do these "spontaneous people" even access Twitter? Smells fishy...

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#109

Post by Retric »

alexron782 wrote: post #91
dragonwriter wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. Is that what they actually feel, or is that exactly the upper limit of what the State accepts as legitimate dissatisfaction with the status quo, which the vast majority of people are aware of an unwilling to…

Well, because the quality of life is indeed getting better and better in China. CCP successfully satisfied the fundamental need of people who were living under extreme poverty before right? Perhaps the next generation of Chinese people will start to demand more freedom, etc..

That would seem logical, but it’s less accurate than you might think. Revolutions actually become more common as society exists famine and extreme poverty.

The issue is when people start wanting more than food and shelter it becomes more apparent all the things they can’t buy like free speech, or more recently clean air.

Re: How China Unleashed Twitter Trolls to Discredit Hong Kong’s Protesters

#110

Post by gonehome »

AFascistWorld wrote: post #38
machbio wrote: post #5

Am starting to feel this trolling is an industry (like troll farm) of its own - there are people or bots dedicated to trolling and reporting people who raise voice against the discrimination.. I recently had to report an unfair service by virgin atlantic staff after an emergency landing - I tweeted the pictures and video of the incident.. I was immediately trolled by twitter accounts about how i should be happy that…

You may not believe it, the vast majority of Chinese actually love the CCP and the system, they only just hate that a few corrupt low-level officials who are the bad apples fucking up leaders' glorious visions. These "bots" are mostly spontaneous people, they are not even government-sponsored Wumao, they genuinely love China and defend it, their reason being it may have some flaws but any other country has too and is…

I suspect when living under a system experiencing nearly miraculous economic growth people are less political and more willing to look the other way with potential abuses.

Growth leads to a lot of things being a lot better for a lot of people.

If that ever slows down though I think there will be trouble.

It's good to think long term, but removing term limits seems to increase risk around transitions of power. Though at the moment I suppose they could point to the US's current political situation as a reason you can't trust the public to have unfiltered access to the internet with elections.

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