Off-Facebook Activity • Hacker News Board

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#101

Post by olliej » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 7:55 PM UTC

nod wrote: post #72

pesenti wrote: post #2

This is the clear history feature that was announced a year ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16969325 . See also the engineering post that explains some of the challenges in implementing this: https://engineering.fb.com/data-infrastructure/off-facebook-...

Why is it no longer a "clear history" feature?

money? Or maybe just Facebook is at its core opposed to the idea of not misleading their users.

I mean it's also worth noting that to access the misleading "clear history" feature you have to create an FB account so they can track you more.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#102

Post by cm2012 » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 7:56 PM UTC

lunchables wrote: post #57

mattkevan wrote: post #12

Hmm, a clear history feature that does nothing of the sort. Sounds like Facebook! The product manager in charge said: “people were able to mentally connect that with how their browser controls work, where they can clear their history. We clearly state that … the information isn’t connected to your account.” [0] So, they deliberately designed it to make people think it works like a browser's clear history feature (whi…

Anyone still using Facebook at this point is insane or has some direct financial motivation to continue using it. I don't know what else people need to see to stop using it.

55% of the Americans use FB every single day of their lives.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#103

Post by olliej » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 7:56 PM UTC

beshrkayali wrote: post #66

In the video she said that the website sends data about you to Facebook. This is incorrect. Facebook is the one doing the collecting or the purchasing of your data from 3rd party collectors. I try to post this on every Facebook related post: Leave Facebook. You'll thank yourself a year from now.

If you leave facebook you can't access the "clear history" feature, so they can track you and keep that information forever.

Facebook is a morally bankrupt company and the only real fix is to black hole their many domains.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#104

Post by echeese » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:04 PM UTC

beshrkayali wrote: post #66

In the video she said that the website sends data about you to Facebook. This is incorrect. Facebook is the one doing the collecting or the purchasing of your data from 3rd party collectors. I try to post this on every Facebook related post: Leave Facebook. You'll thank yourself a year from now.

Not true, you're able to advertise to specific groups of people by sending hashed email addresses in a "Customer List". I found this out when I discovered Rockstar Social Club targeted me for a GTA Online campaign.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#105

Post by hedora » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:15 PM UTC

tobr wrote: post #5

So how will this work if I don’t use a Facebook account?

It looks like they rotate the ID for third party data every 24 hours, but only if you opt out.

Presumably, their tracking is more effective if you simply don’t create an account (so they never rotate the ID).

/Insert a rant about perverse incentives and dark patterns here

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#106

Post by Nextgrid » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:21 PM UTC

joshmarlow wrote: post #95

lunchables wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone still using Facebook at this point is insane or has some direct financial motivation to continue using it. I don't know what else people need to see to stop using it.

As near as I can tell, I think most people: 1) are not particularly well-informed about issues around Facebook 2) aren't willing to go through the effort to be well-informed So the real problem we need to face as a society - Facebook is only one instance of it - is how to get more people to take an interest in the important issues around them? How do we make people into competent citizens?

Traditionally when we have a situation where the masses don’t have the means, equipment or knowledge to make sure for themselves, the law & regulation steps in. This is why you can buy food at a supermarket and be reasonably certain that it’s not toxic without needing biology & chemistry degrees and an expensive lab to analyse the food.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#107

Post by yalogin » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:23 PM UTC

mattkevan wrote: post #12

Hmm, a clear history feature that does nothing of the sort. Sounds like Facebook! The product manager in charge said: “people were able to mentally connect that with how their browser controls work, where they can clear their history. We clearly state that … the information isn’t connected to your account.” [0] So, they deliberately designed it to make people think it works like a browser's clear history feature (whi…

Great point. I did find the selection of words odd. They said "will not be connected to your account" and not "deleted". I wonder if it's because they have no way to stop the collection of such data as any of my connections could be pushing that data to facebook.

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#108

Post by werber » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:27 PM UTC

Who is going to see this that isn't a nerd checking out places like HN like all of us? This doesn't seem like a real effort to aid user privacy, if it was it should be something that pops up in every facebook user's face, not an article you have to search for.

Facebooks attempts at making up for their mistakes almost always leave me feeling worse about the company

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#109

Post by q_queue » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:32 PM UTC

lunchables wrote: post #57

mattkevan wrote: post #12

Hmm, a clear history feature that does nothing of the sort. Sounds like Facebook! The product manager in charge said: “people were able to mentally connect that with how their browser controls work, where they can clear their history. We clearly state that … the information isn’t connected to your account.” [0] So, they deliberately designed it to make people think it works like a browser's clear history feature (whi…

Anyone still using Facebook at this point is insane or has some direct financial motivation to continue using it. I don't know what else people need to see to stop using it.

As much as the more concerned of us cringe when we hear it, "Why should I care, I have nothing to hide?" is going to be the predominant answer to that question from the majority of facebook users. And morals and ethics aside, they have a point - very few facebook users have experienced a direct, tangible, personal harm as a result of facebook's surveillance of them.

The objections are always on the basis of what should be done, what could happen, and the (decreasingly) abstract harm it brings to society as a whole.

Grandma just wants to see pictures of the grandkids and hasn't had a police visit or her passport cancelled because of something she's said online yet, and she probably thinks those concerns are nebulous enough to not worry about, or scoffs at them as crazy conspiracy theory.

Maybe the right thing to do is try to convince her it's worth worrying that her grandkids might live in a dystopian surveillance society where a careless word can cost you your social status and career?

Re: Off-Facebook Activity

#110

Post by daphneokeefe » Tue, Aug 20, 2019, 8:55 PM UTC

ben7799 wrote: post #80

Wait how can I set my preferences for the activity they're tracking on me if I don't have an account? I'm not under any illusions they're not trying to track me despite me not having an account with them.

We know that FB tracks us just as much as the people who have accounts. But we have less access and fewer rights.