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The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

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Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#101

Post by byproxy »

TomMckenny wrote: post #73

Also interesting are the jokes that were removed and added. The Lion gets his courage from a bottle in the original (the joke being a reference to a common joke at the time that some people get their courage from a bottle of liquor) But 1939 was so close to the prohibition fiasco, it seems the producers did not like this joke. Likewise, the scene in the field of (presumably opium) poppies that put everyone to sleep w…

"The Simpsons" are a bad example for your point, I think. I've been watching episodes again and they often put the kids in morally questionable scenarios (much to my laughter). Lisa got drunk at Duff Land (a theme park devoted to beer), for example.

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#102

Post by panarky »

logfromblammo wrote: post #81
tunesmith wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And lending additional money into existence based on fractional reserves of currency is counterfeiting-by-the-law. It's a similiar unethical con to "naked short-selling". Are you referring to debt monetization, QE, something else? I'm unsure if you're referring to something the Fed prevents or actively practices. QE helps to heat up a faltering economy, at the expense of contributing to income inequality.

I mean nothing more than increasing the de facto money supply by lending multiple times against the same reserves. The reserve requirement is a multiplier for whatever new money the Fed decides to issue. But banks don't have to lend all the way up to their maximum, so printing new notes into a fractional reserve regime is actually kind of a mushy and inaccurate way to increase the money supply. Quantitative easing sm…

> So the answer is to create dummy debt ...

QE is buying debt on the public market and removing it from circulation, while injecting newly created money into the economy, in order to increase liquidity.

What is "dummy debt" and how does QE create it?

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#103

Post by feedbeef »

nitwit005 wrote: post #21

I suspect for most of this, they were just trying to be funny or weird rather than intending this symbolism/meaning to come across to the audience. One of my economics textbooks contained an explanation of the theory that the yellow brick road was a reference to monetary policy (gold standard), but that theory seems to have been heavily challenged (See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_T...…

This documentary seems relevant:

Bill Still: The Secret of Oz

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swkq2E8mswI

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#104

Post by anti-cognitive »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #40
rabidrat wrote: post #6

From "Debt, The First 5000 years": L. Frank Baum’s book The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, which appeared in 1900, is widely recognized to be a parable for the Populist campaign of William Jennings Bryan, who twice ran for president on the Free Silver platform – vowing to replace the gold standard with a bimetallic system that would allow the free creation of silver money alongside gold. … [O]ne of the main constituencies f…

> The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, which appeared in 1900, is widely recognized to be a parable for the Populist campaign of William Jennings Bryan, who twice ran for president on the Free Silver platform – vowing to replace the gold standard with a bimetallic system that would allow the free creation of silver money alongside gold. This is more "crackpot theory" than "widely recognized". > the Scarecrow represented the f…

It's funny to me how you seem to grasp at arguing with such a soft fluffy denial. I mean this is less contradiction or refutation and more sulking and pouting about ideas you don't like.

First, you just ad hominem with a blundering crackpot label.

Then you try to dismiss detailed insights with completely compatible interpretations of the subject matter. It's like you didn't even notice that your perspective and opinion of the symbolism and characterization can interoperate and simultaneously work alongside the version you replied to. They aren't mutually exclusive.

But for whatever reason, you've got this smug derision woven into your comment, like you've handily picked apart the ideas you saw fit to quote.

It's very obvious that The Wizard of Oz fits an allegory for the dust bowl and great depression. All the pieces easily snap together when you recognize them for what they are.

You seem to harbor some deep resentment of a truth that terrifies you. But why?

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#105

Post by andrepd »

SilasX wrote: post #45
rabidrat wrote: post #6

From "Debt, The First 5000 years": L. Frank Baum’s book The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, which appeared in 1900, is widely recognized to be a parable for the Populist campaign of William Jennings Bryan, who twice ran for president on the Free Silver platform – vowing to replace the gold standard with a bimetallic system that would allow the free creation of silver money alongside gold. … [O]ne of the main constituencies f…

About as reliable a theory as this part: >Apple Computers is a famous example: it was founded by (mostly Republican) computer engineers who broke from IBM in Silicon Valley in the 1980s, forming little democratic circles of twenty to forty people with their laptops in each other’s garages. https://delong.typepad.com/sdj/2012/02/gabriel-rosser-on-dav...

How can you pack so many wrong things in one sentence...

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#106

Post by rags2riches »

logfromblammo wrote: post #81
tunesmith wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And lending additional money into existence based on fractional reserves of currency is counterfeiting-by-the-law. It's a similiar unethical con to "naked short-selling". Are you referring to debt monetization, QE, something else? I'm unsure if you're referring to something the Fed prevents or actively practices. QE helps to heat up a faltering economy, at the expense of contributing to income inequality.

I mean nothing more than increasing the de facto money supply by lending multiple times against the same reserves. The reserve requirement is a multiplier for whatever new money the Fed decides to issue. But banks don't have to lend all the way up to their maximum, so printing new notes into a fractional reserve regime is actually kind of a mushy and inaccurate way to increase the money supply. Quantitative easing sm…

> The reserve requirement is a multiplier for whatever new money the Fed decides to issue.

This is backwards. The private banks decide to lend first. They then acquire the central bank reserves needed to meet the requirements. The central bank reserves are created on demand, so to speak.

The Fed policy influences the lending decisions of the banks, of course, but it's not as direct as creating reserves and then pushing them out there to be lent out.

Source: https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/-/media/boe/files/quarterly-...

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#107

Post by Jaruzel »

benj111 wrote: post #55
Jaruzel wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Watch Wizard of Oz with the sound off. Just as the MGM lion finishes roaring, drop the needle[1] onto the Dark Side of the Moon LP, and watch as the songs sync up to the imagery. -- [1] Or un-pause the CD/MP3 etc.

"Pink Floyd band members have repeatedly said that the reputed phenomenon is coincidence" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Side_of_the_Rainbow

I was neither agreeing or disagreeing with the concept, merely pointing out how it's done. Also even as a life long Floyd fan, I have never done it.

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#108

Post by drdaeman »

I've read the comments and wanted to write another, but then remembered that a smarter man had written a better one already.

> “I don't understand this at all. I don't understand any of this. Why does a story have to be socio-anything? Politics... culture... history... aren't those natural ingredients in any story, if it's told well? I mean...' [...] 'I mean... can't you guys just let a story be a story?”

> - Stephen King, "It"

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#109

Post by sk5t »

SilasX wrote: post #45
rabidrat wrote: post #6

From "Debt, The First 5000 years": L. Frank Baum’s book The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, which appeared in 1900, is widely recognized to be a parable for the Populist campaign of William Jennings Bryan, who twice ran for president on the Free Silver platform – vowing to replace the gold standard with a bimetallic system that would allow the free creation of silver money alongside gold. … [O]ne of the main constituencies f…

About as reliable a theory as this part: >Apple Computers is a famous example: it was founded by (mostly Republican) computer engineers who broke from IBM in Silicon Valley in the 1980s, forming little democratic circles of twenty to forty people with their laptops in each other’s garages. https://delong.typepad.com/sdj/2012/02/gabriel-rosser-on-dav...

Well, that is certainly some grade-A baloney. One struggles to imagine how or if a clear-minded person put this arrangement of words to paper.

Re: The subversive messages hidden in The Wizard of Oz

#110

Post by 1auralynn »

Frondo wrote: post #88
1auralynn wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention amazing illustrations.

Jack Snow was an absolutely brilliant illustrator -- he did every book after the first one, for a very, very long time. After L Frank Baum wrote the original 14, a few other authors picked up the mantle (Ruth Plumbly Thompson being the most prolific by far) and Jack Snow did all of those, until he authored a few books himself. Sadly, none of the other authors quite captured the surrealism, magic, and originality of t…

Oh I was talking about John R. Neill, who was a big influence on me :) I hadn't heard of Jack Snow!
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