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Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

sciencemag.org

101–110 of 127 posts

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#101

I remember when I was young (+40 years ago), many Swiss private banks would only hire Swiss people. That rule was due to the French IRS equivalent having their own employees sent to Switzerland and hired by Swiss bank. They were mole transmitting confidential information about French clients. So these private banks had to restore trust and security. Honestly still today, for some critial jobs, I do not understand com…

Everyone at my firm must be a United States citizen.

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> credit checks (the credit checks were just dumb). Credit checks are extremely smart. People who are financially vulnerable are high risk.

A credit check is basically relevant to any job. If you can't be trusted to pay back your loans on time as promised how can you be trusted to do your job as promised?

The largest single source of bankruptcy in the US is medical debt. So you are essentially equating having a family member need serious medical care with mendacity, laziness, and general moral failure. Is that really something we want to do?

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do think that was a huge over-reaction, particularly in retrospect, but you can't chalk it up entirely to hysteria considering it happened in the aftermath of the Niihau incident.

> but you can't chalk it up entirely to hysteria considering it happened in the aftermath of the Niihau incident. You're right it wasn't hysteria, it was literal robbery. The white farmers were literally waiting to steal everything the Japanese left behind in California.

Oh yes, I'm aware. And in Seattle when Japanese-Americans were interned, many African-Americans moved into the property left behind, brought to Seattle by the huge surplus of jobs working for Boeing. Today there are Japanese-Americans who object to that neighborhood being called the "International District" because they feel that perpetuates the wrong done to their community.

Incidentally, Boeing was forbidden by the federal government from discriminating against those African-American workers, as they might well have in an earlier era. The Fair Employment Practice Committee which forbade discrimination against these African-American workers was created to implement FDR's Executive Order 8802. That executive order was motivated in no small part by FDR observing American defense companies discriminating against German-Americans and Italian-Americans, which he considered to be a threat to the war effort. This executive order was one of the first times the federal government ever took any action against racial or ethnic discrimination in the workplace.

Strangely the Wikipedia page for the FEPC suggests it was motivated to help "African-Americans and other minorities", while the Wikipedia page for Executive Order 8802 emphasizes that it was discrimination of German-Americans and Italian-Americans which motivated FDR. (I'm more inclined to believe the later, but either way it certainly had the effect of helping the African-American community find work in the defense industry.)

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#104
post #16

>Four of the five NIH letters to MD Anderson contain very specific allegations of what NIH terms “serious” rule violations. One letter, for instance, asserts that a researcher had violated peer-review confidentiality by emailing to a scientist in China an NIH grant application marked as containing “proprietary/privileged information.” A different letter alleges that a researcher had shared “detailed information on as…

For a peer reviewer of a proposal to send it to anyone else is both unethical and against the basic black-letter rules. Anyone doing peer reviews of proposals will be asked to ensure confidentiality of proposals under review. (https://grants.nih.gov/policy/research_integrity/confidentia...)

The level of paranoia around proposals is much higher than, say, peer reviews for conferences or journal papers, where sometimes a paper might be given to a grad student to take a look at.

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#105

It's so weird how US mass media refuses to name/identify some offenders but identifies some offenders by their identities. If some black youth engage in gunplay the headlines read "5 Chicagoans gunned down", if some Chinese scam an Apple store it's "Oregon Students defraud apple store", if a Somali joins ISIS the story goes to press as "Minneapolis Man joins ISIS" or "Another person from Rep. Omar's district joins IS…

But, how local should we get with descriptors? If the issue is about corporate espionage, then the culprit's nationality might be very relevant. However, I'm not sure focusing on ethnicity adds much in your first example. As a counterpoint, when someone ODs in West Virginia, should we report: white, middle-aged person dies of overdose? Another example: white male CEO commits fraud.

I think any level of descriptiveness is fine as long as it's consistent.

If a Chinese thief is an "Oregon Student" then I want a Chinese surgeon who saves lives to be an "Oregon surgeon".

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#106
post #44
post #2

I wonder why the headline says 'Asian' instead of saying Chinese, since all three researchers were Chinese with ties to China. As an ethic Indian, I'm kinda offended when all Asians are just lumped together as I believe it promotes general racism and bias against anyone from that continent .

Agreed. There's no reason to distrust "Asian researchers"; there's reason to distrust "researchers with ties to China in the political climate of 2019".

Reason=racism?

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#107

I remember when I was young (+40 years ago), many Swiss private banks would only hire Swiss people. That rule was due to the French IRS equivalent having their own employees sent to Switzerland and hired by Swiss bank. They were mole transmitting confidential information about French clients. So these private banks had to restore trust and security. Honestly still today, for some critial jobs, I do not understand com…

The people mentioned in the article are Americans. Also discrimination on the basis of ethnicity and national origin is illegal: https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/discrimination/ethnicdisc

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#108
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A credit check is basically relevant to any job. If you can't be trusted to pay back your loans on time as promised how can you be trusted to do your job as promised?

This would be hard to argue against if credit scores were accurate. They're not exactly pseudoscience, but they're still far from perfect. When I was buying my house, I was building up and paying off ~$500 across 4 credit cards (one for Home Depot, one for Uber, etc.) I paid them down to $0 every month. I'd consider that behavior to be financially smart. I got discounts of 5% on all those purchases because of the per…

You didn't mention what that utilization rate was, but it makes perfect sense to me. Using those cards so much gave the impression that you "needed" the credit line, even if you paid it off by the end of the month.

If you have a $50k limit and spend $2k/month, paying off in full, it doesn't really impact your score much at all. If you have $1k limit and spend $500/month it's a big risk.

You can usually make additional payments during the cycle so it doesn't impact your utilization. Whenever I make a larger purchase I just login and pay it off in full right away so it doesn't ding me.

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#109
post #108
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be hard to argue against if credit scores were accurate. They're not exactly pseudoscience, but they're still far from perfect. When I was buying my house, I was building up and paying off ~$500 across 4 credit cards (one for Home Depot, one for Uber, etc.) I paid them down to $0 every month. I'd consider that behavior to be financially smart. I got discounts of 5% on all those purchases because of the per…

You didn't mention what that utilization rate was, but it makes perfect sense to me. Using those cards so much gave the impression that you "needed" the credit line, even if you paid it off by the end of the month. If you have a $50k limit and spend $2k/month, paying off in full, it doesn't really impact your score much at all. If you have $1k limit and spend $500/month it's a big risk. You can usually make additiona…

The utilization rate was ~1%.

Re: Major U.S. cancer center ousts ‘Asian’ researchers after NIH flags foreign ties

#110
post #108
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be hard to argue against if credit scores were accurate. They're not exactly pseudoscience, but they're still far from perfect. When I was buying my house, I was building up and paying off ~$500 across 4 credit cards (one for Home Depot, one for Uber, etc.) I paid them down to $0 every month. I'd consider that behavior to be financially smart. I got discounts of 5% on all those purchases because of the per…

You didn't mention what that utilization rate was, but it makes perfect sense to me. Using those cards so much gave the impression that you "needed" the credit line, even if you paid it off by the end of the month. If you have a $50k limit and spend $2k/month, paying off in full, it doesn't really impact your score much at all. If you have $1k limit and spend $500/month it's a big risk. You can usually make additiona…

Utilization rate is 0 if you pay off every month..
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