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US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

peoplespolicyproject.org

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Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#101

Post by rhacker »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #98
rhacker wrote: post #87

Like to bring this up when we talk taxes: I think it's totally crazy that we give the feds 25% or more and our states soo soo sooooo much less. I think it should be the other way around: 5% for the feds, and maybe 20% to the states. The reason is that our cities are filled with bums, and have absolutely no money to either give them jobs or make new programs. The feds don't give a shit and are busy making missiles or…

But then the tax shelter states wouldn't be able to mooch off of federal programs.

There's going to be a lot of buts I get it. I want someone that can figure this out and move it forward.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#102

Post by maxxxxx »

exodus_de wrote: post #88
maxxxxx wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My family in Germany throws a fit when they have to pay 50 Euro for something. In the US you can happy if your cost for seeing a doctor is less than 4 digits.

> My family in Germany throws a fit when they have to pay 50 Euro for something. Socialized insurance rates in Germany are 15% of income. Unless your family doesn't earn any money, they have been paying far more than 50 Euros. > In the US you can happy if your cost for seeing a doctor is less than 4 digits. That isn't generally true. Every insurance plan is different. Cheap plans have a high deductible. It's similar…

"It's basically like this: If you're gonna be poor, go to Germany. Everyone else will pay for you. If you're going to earn well, leave Germany, otherwise you're going to be paying for everyone else."

You should add this to your algorithm for location choice: If you get a serious health problem and want to become poor, come to the US.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#103

Post by enraged_camel »

exodus_de wrote: post #88
maxxxxx wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My family in Germany throws a fit when they have to pay 50 Euro for something. In the US you can happy if your cost for seeing a doctor is less than 4 digits.

> My family in Germany throws a fit when they have to pay 50 Euro for something. Socialized insurance rates in Germany are 15% of income. Unless your family doesn't earn any money, they have been paying far more than 50 Euros. > In the US you can happy if your cost for seeing a doctor is less than 4 digits. That isn't generally true. Every insurance plan is different. Cheap plans have a high deductible. It's similar…

>>Socialized insurance rates in Germany are 15% of income. Unless your family doesn't earn any money, they have been paying far more than 50 Euros.

Comments like this always miss the larger point, which is that healthcare overall is cheaper in socialized systems because the government as a large entity negotiates on behalf of citizens and puts strong downward pressure on prices.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#104

Post by exodus_de »

maxxxxx wrote: post #80
vonmoltke wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In the US you can happy if your cost for seeing a doctor is less than 4 digits. My wife and I have never paid four figures for a doctor visit, despite having two surgeries (one oral), a calf strain, and a dislocated shoulder (with ER visit) between us. The state of medical care in the US is bad enough as it is; you don't need to make up hyperbolic bullshit to make it seem worse.

I fell down the stairs and had a muscle spasm in my back. Had to go an ER. I had insurance that was considered good and it still cost me $350 for 10 minutes with the doctor and a bottle of muscle relaxers.

An ER visit is not the same as a simple doctor's visit. If ER visits are necessary (questionable in this case), they are covered by insurance - by law. Your deductible still applies.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#106

Post by throwaway284721 »

rhacker wrote: post #87

Like to bring this up when we talk taxes: I think it's totally crazy that we give the feds 25% or more and our states soo soo sooooo much less. I think it should be the other way around: 5% for the feds, and maybe 20% to the states. The reason is that our cities are filled with bums, and have absolutely no money to either give them jobs or make new programs. The feds don't give a shit and are busy making missiles or…

The reason for this is that if one state has better social programs then another and higher taxes the poorest are going to move there, and the high earners are going to move away.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#107

Post by analog31 »

dnautics wrote: post #91
arosier wrote: post #12

>It’s just that they pay it into a private insurance system that wastes large portions of it on rents and administrative redundancy. Would love to see a breakdown of real estate and admin costs for private insurance systems throughout the States to understand how much could be saved by eliminating redundancy. Not seeing this broken out in Anthem's Financials: https://ir.antheminc.com/static-files/73562e56-886c-4ff5-a…

Private healthcare insurance has margins well below most profitable companies, in the us. If anything I'd hazard that the poor treatment of consumers by these entities stems from being barely able to hold the line, not because of greed. Rising medical costs, I think, have the blame elsewhere, but insurance companies sure do make a good Boogeyman for politicians, because they are very poorly understood.

Somebody's gouging us. Who? Everybody cries poor and points the finger at everybody else. Nobody knows where the money is actually going.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#108

Post by thorwasdfasdf »

rhacker wrote: post #87

Like to bring this up when we talk taxes: I think it's totally crazy that we give the feds 25% or more and our states soo soo sooooo much less. I think it should be the other way around: 5% for the feds, and maybe 20% to the states. The reason is that our cities are filled with bums, and have absolutely no money to either give them jobs or make new programs. The feds don't give a shit and are busy making missiles or…

This.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#109

Post by mschuetz »

jakobegger wrote: post #92
Someone1234 wrote: post #19

I moved to the US from a country with socialised medicine. When you include premiums then taxes in both were roughly similar if not a little higher in the US (ignoring cost of living differences). But even that doesn't include the real sting on the tail of US medicine. You pay a fairly high health insurance premium, but if you actually need health services you then pay again through the nose even with insurance "disc…

As a point of comparison, in Austria: - taking a kid to the ER costs nothing - taking a kid to a GP or a pediatrician costs nothing - staying a night at the hospital costs around 15€ - getting a prescription from the pharmacy costs 5€

Yeah, and cost of health insurance in Austria is just 7,65% of your income, and it covers your children. When I've worked in the US, I've paid just as much for health insurance and still had high out-of-pockets and deductibles on top of that.

Re: US Workers Are Highly Taxed If You Count Premiums

#110

Post by titanomachy »

FactolSarin wrote: post #89
vonmoltke wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An emergency room is not a "basic visit".

The greatest trick healthcare companies have pulled is convincing Americans that after hours visits for things like high fevers and broken bones isn't basic care. I'm 40, and my Mom was telling me about how my brother cut his head as a child, and the local small town doctor came in after hours to stitch it up. Different era.

Yeah, it's relatively low-probability but still essential. Getting a broken bone fixed seems like more of a basic human right than a "premium service".
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