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Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

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Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#101

Post by Barrin92 »

untog wrote: post #87
munk-a wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And this will last until... self-driving cars enter the picture and bankrupt them both.

Given the amount Uber has spent on self driving cars, I doubt they'd let themselves get replaced. Given the money the entire industry has spent on self driving cars and gotten little reward for, I don't think anyone is getting replaced for a very long time.

Also, uber has no assets. Are they going to add the overhead of an autonomous car fleet in every city on top of their already crazy cash burn rate?

I don't see how this business model even works.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#102

Post by dragonwriter »

computerex wrote: post #96
amoitnga wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an investor, no experience, just want to voice my 2c. - facebook and google sure, but how many are there of those who didn't make it? - sounds like a fear of missing out. - Buffet didn't invest in Microsoft because he didn't "get it". His idea, I believe, is: "it's ok to pass on investments". He's looking for "sure things". Personally, I think the entire thing is ridiculous. 120B ? for what? 2 of my friends a…

Don't forget that Uber is in the autonomous driving business. They burnt through cash to get market share, because when self driving becomes a thing, they'll have a huge swing in margins/profits as self driving will get rid of their greatest expense (human drivers).

> Don't forget that Uber is in the autonomous driving business.

Or, at least, has spent a lot of money failing to be in that business.

> They burnt through cash to get market share, because when self driving becomes a thing, they'll have a huge swing in margins/profits as self driving will get rid of their greatest expense (human drivers).

Established relationship with human drivers and the acquisition cost to overcome that is a big part of Uber’s moat, which is potentially erased when self-driving from anyone but Uber is real.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#103

Post by georgeecollins »

computerex wrote: post #96
amoitnga wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an investor, no experience, just want to voice my 2c. - facebook and google sure, but how many are there of those who didn't make it? - sounds like a fear of missing out. - Buffet didn't invest in Microsoft because he didn't "get it". His idea, I believe, is: "it's ok to pass on investments". He's looking for "sure things". Personally, I think the entire thing is ridiculous. 120B ? for what? 2 of my friends a…

Don't forget that Uber is in the autonomous driving business. They burnt through cash to get market share, because when self driving becomes a thing, they'll have a huge swing in margins/profits as self driving will get rid of their greatest expense (human drivers).

I believe Rodney Brooks when he says that autonomous cars are much farther away than some predict. Not in five years anyway.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#104

Post by ghaff »

dragonwriter wrote: post #88
Pyxl101 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It always seemed very strange to me that it's legal for company-expensed credit card purchases to generate individual, personal rewards for the card holders. (And these awards aren't even taxed?) Something feels underhanded about it, though I can't put my finger on it.

The theory of why normal credit card rewards aren't taxable is that they are a discount. OTOH, if it's a corporate expensed card or purchase, but the discount goes to the employee, it seems that either: (1) the “reimbursement” for the full cost isn't all bona-fide reimbursement, since you are getting reimbursement for more than you paid after the discount, and therefore should be taxed like any other compensation fro…

It’s mostly (with some exemptions) formal policy from the IRS. I suspect the real justification is that a lot of these things are hard to value, the numbers are small in the scheme of things, and compliance would be very low. It actually makes a lot of sense not to put a rule in the books everyone would ignore.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#105

Post by sherlock_h »

fierro wrote: post #79
sherlock_h wrote: post #31

Over the long run, at least in the U.S. it seems like Uber/Lyft are edging towards a comfortable duopoly. Usually their prices move in lockstep (each has insights into the other company's prices through email receipt intelligence, credit card intelligence, webscraping, etc.). And their services are fairly exchangeable. For either one to win there needs to be either a massive cost advantage or some sort of stickiness…

don't discount the ability for either company to build that stickiness. They know this is important. Think credit cards, collaboration with last-mile transportation (Uber + Bird), discounts on restaurants, things of that nature. They can and are working towards building more of a brand ecosystem.

That's what they are both trying to do but I just don't see the big breakthrough there yet. Even Ridesharing + X (e.g. bikes or scooters) they are moving the same direction. really curious to see how this plays out – pretty exciting from a spectator perspective.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#106

Post by anth_anm »

ghaff wrote: post #56
maaaats wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If one could reliably order an Uber that would be great. But no way Im waiting outside in -10C while the app lies about someone about to pick me up.

Yeah. Much better to make the driver wait for you. I’m sure you’re very important.

Or just pay them for waiting.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#107

Post by nerfhammer »

crispyporkbites wrote: post #36
sjjshvuiajhz wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UberPool Express has some things in common with the bus, although I’ve still never been slapped in the face by a homeless man in an Uber.

I get a bus twice a day in London and not once has this or even the thought of this come into my head.

One time in SF on the subway I saw an ostensibly homeless woman go up to a random man and demand his sweater. When he refused, she tried to physically tear it off of him. He had to sort of kick and shove her away until he could get away.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#108

Post by lozaning »

ecshafer wrote: post #68
lozaning wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can see the add now "Save 4% on negligible travel costs for the low low price of pissing off your traveling employees who are generating million in revenue" It's not worth our controllers time to worry about something so insignificant.

Would anyone really care that much. If my company told me to use Lyft over uber or reversed it wouldn't cause any duress. I just need to get from the airport and back or whatever, its hard to have a preference here.

Without status everything is fungible. That changes drastically as your status on any given provider goes up.

Making me take anything but United means no business class upgrade, making me take anything but Uber means im waiting way longer to be picked up from anywhere, making me not stay at SPG means no room upgrade or check-in/checkout perks.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#109

Post by ham_sandwich »

warp_factor wrote: post #97
untog wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the amount Uber has spent on self driving cars, I doubt they'd let themselves get replaced. Given the money the entire industry has spent on self driving cars and gotten little reward for, I don't think anyone is getting replaced for a very long time.

Uber has spent a lot of money on Self Driving car (remember the Otto fiasco ?) and is hypothetically the least advanced of them all!

Yes, from the looks of it, they are well behind in self-driving tech. If it’s inevitable that self-driving will bankrupt them, why would anyone invest in them at all?

The two scenarios I can see are

1). That their ride-matching platform will still play a role in a self-driving world. However, I think a worst case for Uber is Waymo gets there first and then Google can almost trivially replace Uber with their own matching platform.

2.) They acquire a startup that has a successful direct self-driving play.

Either way, the economics of their core offering changes drastically. I have a hard time believing investors in Uber aren’t pricing this in at least somewhat accurately.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#110

Post by alexpetralia »

warp_factor wrote: post #98
justfor1comment wrote: post #80

Uber is getting more expensive with time as they try to consolidate losses. For my commute to work nowadays Express Pool costs the same as UberX did a year ago. And of course express pool includes overtly long sight seeing detours and dangerous pick up/drop off points. This is getting prohibitively expensive and I plan to switch to an electric scooter + public transit in a few months.

This is a good summary of the VC economy: Use it as long as it is subsidized by VC Money, then switch back to whatever you used before.

Also the part about one VC passing the buck to the next, allowing them all to benefit reputationally from asset inflation - until the bubble pops. Then only the last ones holding the bag lose.

Edit: VC is actually not passing to VC, but larger investment funds like PE.

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