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Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

nhs.uk

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Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#101

Post by tracker1 »

httpsterio wrote: post #90
chrisweekly wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tangent: low-fat diets don't actually help with weight loss

Well, partially true. Fat is very energy rich so low fat diets will typically have less calories and calories are basically the only thing you need to worry about when trying to lose weight.

On the flip side protein in particular is very sating, and protein + fat (in the absence of carbs) has a much lower insulin response. So a higher fat diet with protein sources will have an increased satiety.

Calories do count, but hormonal response is a primary factor.

Edit: it's worth noting that a certain amount of fat is absolutely needed and is sating in and of itself.

Personally, I don't think the amount of fat you get (in terms of calories) should be lower than the amount of protein you consume, and should come from better sources excluding refined vegetable oils (which are everywhere). My opinion on this is somewhat based on the relative amounts of fat to protein in sources where you get protein naturally. I also feel that not getting enough fat is a big factor in gallbladder dysfunction and stones.

A lot of my opinions are just from common sense, observation and a lot of reading on relatively recent diet and nutrition shifts, and feel levels/extremes can vary based on general health, metabolic syndrome indicators and outright diabetic progression.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#102

Post by emmanueloga_ »

mjfl wrote: post #97
throw97 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which service did you use for gene sequencing?

23andme

Related question, is there any service or open source tool people use to get more thorough insights on the raw data you can download from 23 and me?

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#103

Post by anongraddebt »

sethrin wrote: post #96
anongraddebt wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My claim is only that a single neurologist said if any cognitive training might help, then N-Back training would be it. I have no other evidence other than my friend's testimony. Say the neurologist did say this, what's the implication? That you have defeasible justification for trying N-Back training, on recently diagnosed dementia patients, if you've already made the decision that cognitive training is worth pursui…

Hearsay and anecdote are not useful for determining the empirical validity of a theory or therapy. I don't know you, and I have no idea if your reporting is accurate, or if so, who this neurologist might have been, or whether they are trustworthy, and even if they are, I don't have any information as to whether this specific opinion is sound. Without empirical evidence, there is no objective reason to believe any par…

You are right that hearsay and anecdote are not useful for determining the empirical validity of a theory or therapy. However, hearsay and anecdote have been useful a million times over in helping people solve problems or challenges they've faced at certain times and in certain places (whether fully or partially).

People you don't know will tell you things like, "Do crossword puzzles. That will keep you sharp." I'm someone you don't know, and I'm telling you, "If you've decided to do some cognitive training, you should give N-Back training a try in the manner I described."

Maybe it will help you sleep on a night where you have trouble sleeping. Maybe it helps your mental acuity. Maybe nothing. Maybe it will be a waste of 30 minutes for you.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#104

Post by anongraddebt »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #91
anongraddebt wrote: post #61

FWIW, I told a good friend to get her dementia-diagnosed father on a schedule of daily Dual N-Back training using open source programs (e.g. Brainworkshop). She asked his neurologist how effective this would be and he basically said, "it's the only cognitive training that could do anything." Not only is Dual N-Back a great mental workout, but it will also put you to sleep pretty quickly if you set the parameters such…

BTW what is the definition of "'randomness' factor or level of pattern obscurity"?

Two different examples representing two different dimensions to this:

(1) Say you're doing a minute long session and trying to catch auditory letter repeats that are supposed to occur around 5-8 times. On more fully featured N-Back progams you can reduce that number, so that only 1-2 repeats (say) occur. This can make it more difficult for some people because they hear too many false positives (if that makes any sense).

(2) You can change up the default parameters so that repeats are more finely staggered. For instance, take the following two strings:

AHJADCBWPORP (repeats are A and P)

AHPACPWBORJD (repeats are A and P)

The default setting for some programs will just create the first type of string, which can make it more predictable, and thus less mentally taxing. You can tune the parameters so that you get more strings like the second.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#105

Post by mjfl »

emmanueloga_ wrote: post #102
mjfl wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

23andme

Related question, is there any service or open source tool people use to get more thorough insights on the raw data you can download from 23 and me?

I'm not sure there is such a service. You can download the raw data on 23andme, it's just a bunch of SNPs though. I'm not sure there's much known about them other than what's already flagged by their service.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#106

Post by sandos »

ww520 wrote: post #38

They ought to have a study on whether playing fast paced video game shows down mental decline.

Not related to memory, but I have had trouble with balance issues for years, and I'm only 38 years old. Now I got a Xbox One X recently, which means, of course, increased gaming. I'm not 100% yet but it does seem to have almost wiped my balance issues. I was always feeling nauseous and tired when, for example, moving my head too quickly sideways, or simply driving a car.

Its not outside the realm of possibility, my hypothesis is that I am very visually dependent when it comes to my sense of balance. Lots of fast-moving visual stimuli without any input to my balance organ probably tunes my brain to not use my eyes as much. There is also something called "Roll adaptation" which is rolling the head under visual stimuli that does not match. Maybe I should roll my head when gaming for even better effect...

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#107

Post by sethrin »

anongraddebt wrote: post #103
sethrin wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hearsay and anecdote are not useful for determining the empirical validity of a theory or therapy. I don't know you, and I have no idea if your reporting is accurate, or if so, who this neurologist might have been, or whether they are trustworthy, and even if they are, I don't have any information as to whether this specific opinion is sound. Without empirical evidence, there is no objective reason to believe any par…

You are right that hearsay and anecdote are not useful for determining the empirical validity of a theory or therapy. However, hearsay and anecdote have been useful a million times over in helping people solve problems or challenges they've faced at certain times and in certain places (whether fully or partially). People you don't know will tell you things like, "Do crossword puzzles. That will keep you sharp." I'm s…

I have no idea why you think that any of this might be persuasive. Do you really do what random people on the Internet tell you, with no evidence, just because they say it's a good idea? And were I to accept this proposal, there are no conditions for success or failure: a willing mind would make for any number of post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacies.

Empiricism is a much more reliable way to know things than hearsay: this is the general reason for the push towards evidence-based medicine. There is every reason to reject unproven therapies, and what you are offering can not be distinguished from fiction. If you want to make a convincing case for this, you have no alternative but empirical evidence.

Personally, if programming, playing an instrument, drawing, learning languages, and studying mathematics, physics, and history aren't enough to keep my mind sharp, I'm probably not going to worry too much about it.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#108

Post by arctangent »

BossHogg wrote: post #98
arctangent wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

www.nhs.uk/news exists specifically to debunk false health claims (I'm tech lead for this site)

Thought this was a great site. Then I looked for the rss feed. Still good but...

We syndicate our content in a different way: https://developer.api.nhs.uk/

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#109

Post by emmanueloga_ »

mjfl wrote: post #105
emmanueloga_ wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Related question, is there any service or open source tool people use to get more thorough insights on the raw data you can download from 23 and me?

I'm not sure there is such a service. You can download the raw data on 23andme, it's just a bunch of SNPs though. I'm not sure there's much known about them other than what's already flagged by their service.

There's a actually a lot more info than what they show you. They won't show you something depending on many factors including FDA approval, etc. So there's a potential whole lot of information that you are missing out if you don't run your data through other services and tools.

I did a google search and found a bunch of resources, but I though some ppl here may have actual experiences to share.

Re: Puzzle-solving 'doesn't slow down mental decline in older people'

#110

Post by anongraddebt »

sethrin wrote: post #107
anongraddebt wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right that hearsay and anecdote are not useful for determining the empirical validity of a theory or therapy. However, hearsay and anecdote have been useful a million times over in helping people solve problems or challenges they've faced at certain times and in certain places (whether fully or partially). People you don't know will tell you things like, "Do crossword puzzles. That will keep you sharp." I'm s…

I have no idea why you think that any of this might be persuasive. Do you really do what random people on the Internet tell you, with no evidence, just because they say it's a good idea? And were I to accept this proposal, there are no conditions for success or failure: a willing mind would make for any number of post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacies. Empiricism is a much more reliable way to know things than hearsay:…

I'm not sure what your argument is.

This is an example of hearsay and anecodote:

"Hey Joe, this brand of probiotic worked well for me. You should give it a try."

After hearing that, should Joe then look for meta-analyses of the effectiveness of different probiotic brands, or does he have defeasible justification for trying it out? Maybe you'll say a search for meta-analyses is too stringent, but that you could at least look at anonymous reviews on Amazon. Fine. Then go look at collections of anonymous anecdotal reports in the N-Back community.

You keep trying to describe a form of rigid empiricism, as-if I don't actually know or care about epistemology. I did a concentration in philosophy of science in undergrad, and was an editor/reviewer for an entry on the philosophy of science in the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy. I'm not unfamiliar with empiricism.

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