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Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

nytimes.com

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Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#101

Post by pgt »

madengr wrote: post #10

RF/Microwave EE here. I actually tried this on myself several years ago with no effect. Specifically 20W at C-band into a 10 dBi standard gain horn a few feet away, pulse mod to 1 kHz. That was still not near enough power density. While it’s plausible, it would take a big effort to affect this many people. The peak power densities, as described in the paper, would be tens of W/cm^2; e.g. radar transmitters and big an…

Could higher-frequency harmonics be resonating in cavities acting as waveguides?

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#102

Post by jazzyjackson »

no_identd wrote: post #100
madengr wrote: post #10

RF/Microwave EE here. I actually tried this on myself several years ago with no effect. Specifically 20W at C-band into a 10 dBi standard gain horn a few feet away, pulse mod to 1 kHz. That was still not near enough power density. While it’s plausible, it would take a big effort to affect this many people. The peak power densities, as described in the paper, would be tens of W/cm^2; e.g. radar transmitters and big an…

I'll quote Allan H. Frey, who more-or-less(preceeded by some italian engineers, iirc) invented the entire field, from 1996 on usenet: >There is a microwave hearing effect that occurs at very low power densities and a skull vibration effect that occurs when very high energies are applied to the head. There is some confusion in the literature because the vibration effect has often been referred to as a microwave hearin…

I have this notion that surrounding a subject with basket case conspiracy theories would be a good way to get people not to take it seriously :) Of course, there's many feedback loops that allow believers to have their beliefs bolstered by negations.

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#103

Post by no_identd »

d0100 wrote: post #82
mrb wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your link is the first time I hear of mass psychogenic illness. Quite an interesting phenomenon. I particularly liked the case below from 1972. It seems MPI could very well explain these incidents. « In a mid-western university town of over 50,000 population, a strange case of "gas poisoning" occurred on a Wednesday morning early in March, 1972. Approximately thirty-five female workers at the University's data proces…

Mass psych illness is brought up everytime this is discussed

Indeed:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/12/cuba-mass-hyst...

But that doesn't make it neccesarily true, see my other comment here, in context with the comment I responded to there:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17894909

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#104

Post by no_identd »

bcaa7f3a8bbc wrote: post #13
russfink wrote: post #11

Is there a defense against this kind of thing? Not to sound cliche, but would a tin foil hat work?

A simple experiment result published by the MIT Media Lab, found tinfoil hats are not really effective. https://web.archive.org/web/20100708230258/http://people.csa... > For all helmets, we noticed a 30 db __amplification__ at 2.6 Ghz and a 20 db amplification at 1.2 Ghz, regardless of the position of the antenna on the cranium. In addition, all helmets exhibited a marked 20 db attenuation at around 1.5 Ghz, with no…

Back in (one of?) the very first paper(s?) on this stuff, Frey actually pointed out that a 2x2 piece of flyscreen (of some density, I forgot which) on the temporal lobes blocks the EM/RF hearing effect. But, as I pointed out in another comment, two distinct effects exist:

One that induces EM/RF hearing, and one that induces tissue damage.

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#105

Post by no_identd »

escherplex wrote: post #73
escherplex wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good commentary but I wonder if inadvertently you may have been out-of-band in your research. In 'Auditory Response to Pulsed Radiofrequency Energy - Elder (2003)' URL: http://www.beperkdestraling.org/images/stories/Wetenschap/Ti... Auditory_Response_to_Pulsed_radiofrequency_energy.pdf Two salient points crop up: 1) 'The fundamental frequency of RF induced sounds is independent of the frequency of the radiowaves but…

aside: given it's a long link you have to add Auditory_Response_to_Pulsed_radiofrequency_energy.pdf to the address

That... shouldn't break? Let me try:

http://www.beperkdestraling.org/images/stories/Wetenschap/Ti...

Edit: Link seems to work. :)

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#106

Post by wruza »

thefounder wrote: post #90
wruza wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How a specific form of government somewhere outside of US is a problem for US? Why exactly would they like to change it?

I believe that as the leader of the free world U.S has certain responsibilities that go beyond its borders. If it can do something good (i.e overthrow a dictator) and perhaps serves its interests as well(make new friends) I don't see why it shouldn't do that. It's a win-win. See South and North Korea situation to understand what difference it makes a successful intervention.

Which countries experienced something good from a succesful US intervention? Why does US criticize other win-win interventions?

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#107

Post by no_identd »

jazzyjackson wrote: post #102
no_identd wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll quote Allan H. Frey, who more-or-less(preceeded by some italian engineers, iirc) invented the entire field, from 1996 on usenet: >There is a microwave hearing effect that occurs at very low power densities and a skull vibration effect that occurs when very high energies are applied to the head. There is some confusion in the literature because the vibration effect has often been referred to as a microwave hearin…

I have this notion that surrounding a subject with basket case conspiracy theories would be a good way to get people not to take it seriously :) Of course, there's many feedback loops that allow believers to have their beliefs bolstered by negations.

>I have this notion that surrounding a subject with basket case conspiracy theories would be a good way to get people not to take it seriously :)

Indeed, it would. A lot of clever people have discussed the issue of disinfo & FUD, you might wish to:

* Watch this talk from FOSDEM '14 by Poul-Henning Kamp [Contextually, one important tidbit to keep in mind while watching it: At the time phk gave the talk, the heartbleed vulnerability in OpenSSL wasn't yet known!]:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwcl17Q0bpk

* and, perhaps, read these two blog posts, but tread carefully with those two, as, unlike the above video, the below edges MOST dangerously close to basket case conspiracy theory territory - arguably, it doesn't get there, but I can definitely say that if one slips while looking into the below, one'll immediately end up in basket case territory:

https://squamuglia.wordpress.com/2017/04/16/67/

https://squamuglia.wordpress.com/2017/04/22/yes-kids-cookie-...

However, having said this & pointed out all of the above, before going down any of the above lanes, keep something else in mind:

1. Take a look at when some of these links got first published online. Multi-decade gap vs. original date of publication. Something unfortunately still the norm for a lot of old(er) scientific/academic literature.

2. Most of Frey's original papers from the 60s are still behind a HARD paywall. Again, unfortunately still the norm for a lot of old(er) scientific/academic literature.

3. The whole classified Radar tech research aspect of it (This whole avenue of research got started out when radar techs in the 60s started complaining about headaches when working in front of big damn radar dishes!)

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#108

Post by madengr »

no_identd wrote: post #100
madengr wrote: post #10

RF/Microwave EE here. I actually tried this on myself several years ago with no effect. Specifically 20W at C-band into a 10 dBi standard gain horn a few feet away, pulse mod to 1 kHz. That was still not near enough power density. While it’s plausible, it would take a big effort to affect this many people. The peak power densities, as described in the paper, would be tens of W/cm^2; e.g. radar transmitters and big an…

I'll quote Allan H. Frey, who more-or-less(preceeded by some italian engineers, iirc) invented the entire field, from 1996 on usenet: >There is a microwave hearing effect that occurs at very low power densities and a skull vibration effect that occurs when very high energies are applied to the head. There is some confusion in the literature because the vibration effect has often been referred to as a microwave hearin…

The mmWaves can easily be wave guided into the inner ear, as 1/2 wavelength at 60 GHz is 2.5 mm.

I read a few years ago about electric fields of very high dV/dt being used to temporarily open cell walls. The patients blood was transfused through the apparatus. This was used to enhance chemotherapy, and provided some benefit.

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#109

Post by driverdan »

MrTonyD wrote: post #83

I keep reading about quantum entanglement - and how it has been used in practice to transmit secure messages. Seems like it is a technology that might somehow be used to induce frequencies without leaving any evidence. A lot of that works is secret, so it's hard to tell what is really being done.

Quantum physics only works at the quantum level. It's impossible for it to do anything like this.

Re: Microwave Weapons Are Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers

#110

Post by kurthr »

Immortalin wrote: post #75
kurthr wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't even need SDR... a really simple LED and a few variable antennas would do a good job into the GHz.

Do you need a Schottky or will the plain LED work?

With the Schottky you will get better low power detection (lower forward voltage 0.18V vs 1.8V), but it doesn't inherently indicate activation (you'd want an electret or piezo speaker at least) with the same dynamic range as your eye is capable of with an LED. Of course if you have an RMS power meter with uW resolution it will be OK... but LEDs are really good.
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