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Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

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Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#101

Post by lurquer »

martincmartin wrote: post #41
dominotw wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this true? Do you have an example?

"Beijing granted Ivanka trademarks, Qatar invested in one of Jared’s office towers, and Ukraine, with Slavic candor, simply wired half a million dollars to the President’s personal lawyer Michael Cohen." From the Maclean's article in the top comment.

HN shouldn't regurgitate political hit pieces. Ivanka Trump's business has trademarks registered throughout the world... it is no great honor to get a trademark registered in China.

Qatar did not invest in Kushener's office tower.

And, a payment to Cohen by Ukrsine has been denied. (And, in any case, would be perfectly legal so long as the appropriate lobbying paperwork was filled out.)

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#102

Post by toomanybeersies »

krapp wrote: post #93
newnewpdro wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am finding it difficult to accept this is the reality we live in: "the President can be successfully engaged, and countries like Ukraine, China, and Qatar have demonstrated this. When they want something from the United States, they skip the State Department, and even the White House staff. Instead of approaching their problem state-to-state, they go state-to-man. These countries focus on what Trump wants on a pers…

But I thought Trump couldn't be bought because he's a self-made businessman who tells it like it is, no hassle, no haggle, no bullshit, unlike those effete city dwellers and globalist politicians? Is America Great Again yet? A chicken in every pot and a car in every garage? Don't worry about steel, we'll open the steel mills up again. We have to build plenty of new aircraft carriers so we'll need a lot of steel. And…

Don't forget that the wall needs to be see-through, so you can see if any Mexicans are trying to catapult drugs over, which might land on and kill innocent Americans.

Oh, and we can put solar panels on the wall, which will help pay for the wall with the power generated, even though the Mexicans are paying for the wall via increased tariffs on Mexican goods, forcing American consumers to pay more.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#103

Post by kakwa_ »

BurningFrog wrote: post #53
parvenu74 wrote: post #11

Can anyone point to an historical case study where protective tariffs resulted in a better economic or social outcome? I can’t help but recall the saying: “When goods don’t cross borders, soldiers soon will.” Not that I think the United States is going to war with Canada, but the (German-dominated) EU and China are less certain.

Tariffs can be good for big companies and other special interests in a country, but never for the country as a whole. So when you ask if they result in "better economic or social outcome", you have to be careful to think about "for who?".

Not necessarily.

Let say you are a large developing country and you want to bootstrap a domestic car industry. The first cars coming out will probably not be that great as you don't have the engineering knowledge or the experience building cars yet.

Cars built by foreign companies are definitively better, and maybe cheaper to buy and/or to operate.

If you do nothing, this new car industry would die quite soon.

So you impose tariffs on foreign cars, that way your domestic production is protected, and you are able to make it grow and make it better. However be careful to not protect it too much, otherwise it will keep producing crappy cars looking like Trabant. With time you decrease the protection progressively.

Another less abstract example is food, for instance, rice production and tariffs in Haiti:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rice_production_in_Haiti

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#104

Post by dominotw »

peteretep wrote: post #62
dominotw wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this true? Do you have an example?

It's hard for me to believe this is being asked in good faith

i did ask it in good faith. Sorry whole world doesn't follow american politics closely, believe it or not.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#105

Post by pritambaral »

AlexCoventry wrote: post #92
pscnv wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a horrible idea to get rid of your local industry of basic, vital needs. A country could squeeze your balls by cutting off exports to you.

In what sense is milk a vital need, though? Millions of people live without it.

> Millions of people live without it [milk].

Many more depend on dairy.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#106

Post by ameister14 »

throwaway5752 wrote: post #90
ameister14 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That implies an equal number of each party or general affiliation - it wasn't. 9 of the 166 respondents considered themselves conservative. Trump is not a good president, don't get me wrong, but that's just not good science.

It's not science, it's a survey. And you know that about the respondents because they were transparent about their data . And the self-identified conservatives rated him in the bottom five, too.

Surveys are very much a scientific tool. This one surveyed social scientists, who use surveys (like this one) regularly as part of conducting social science.

Yes, they were transparent. You, on the other hand, implied equal numbers.

Nobody likes Trump. There's no need to inflate how bad he is - it's very apparent.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#107

Post by oceanghost »

krapp wrote: post #93
newnewpdro wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am finding it difficult to accept this is the reality we live in: "the President can be successfully engaged, and countries like Ukraine, China, and Qatar have demonstrated this. When they want something from the United States, they skip the State Department, and even the White House staff. Instead of approaching their problem state-to-state, they go state-to-man. These countries focus on what Trump wants on a pers…

But I thought Trump couldn't be bought because he's a self-made businessman who tells it like it is, no hassle, no haggle, no bullshit, unlike those effete city dwellers and globalist politicians? Is America Great Again yet? A chicken in every pot and a car in every garage? Don't worry about steel, we'll open the steel mills up again. We have to build plenty of new aircraft carriers so we'll need a lot of steel. And…

> But I thought Trump couldn't be bought

As it turns out, the surface area for attack is much greater.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#108

Post by s2g »

sonnyblarney wrote: post #46
s2g wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it also keeps Can/Mex standard of living lower in many ways. I'm curious what ways you would argue Canada has a significantly lower standard of living.

"I'm curious what ways you would argue Canada has a significantly lower standard of living." I'm Canadian. Our GDP/cap is usually lower. I work in tech, my salary is less than 1/2 what it would be in the US (not just Silicon Valley). Most goods are more expensive here. We do have Universal Health care, and generally good schools and Unis, it's generally safer, cops are more low key etc. etc. It's hard to compare soci…

So am I, and I make less money but my standard of living isn't that much higher. Certainly less than I would expect making twice as much. Our HDI is the same. GDP per capita in the states is about 10k higher, but Gini is lower in Canada.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#109

Post by s2g »

verelo wrote: post #65
sonnyblarney wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I'm curious what ways you would argue Canada has a significantly lower standard of living." I'm Canadian. Our GDP/cap is usually lower. I work in tech, my salary is less than 1/2 what it would be in the US (not just Silicon Valley). Most goods are more expensive here. We do have Universal Health care, and generally good schools and Unis, it's generally safer, cops are more low key etc. etc. It's hard to compare soci…

> I work in tech, my salary is less than 1/2 what it would be in the US (not just Silicon Valley). Yes, but I'd argue that SV income might look higher, but after you try living there you'd gladly go back to Canadian expenses if the compromise was that you also had to take your Canadian income once again. Also, income inequality in Canada isn't as bad as the US (yet...)

Why? Do you think people are too stupid to do basic math? Totally ignorant of their monthly expenses? What is it that compels people like you to bring up "cost of living" as though anyone who says "higher salary" is a complete moron?

Is it just bay area zealots on both sides embracing the meme that "IT'S SO EXPENSIVE".

We get it. we know. We don't look at SF and go "oh wow, 10 k more a year" while paying 2000 a month more in rent. We look at it and go "oh wow, 110k more a year, even with the rents thats a lot of money".

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#110

Post by s2g »

throwaway5752 wrote: post #63
sonnyblarney wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I'm curious what ways you would argue Canada has a significantly lower standard of living." I'm Canadian. Our GDP/cap is usually lower. I work in tech, my salary is less than 1/2 what it would be in the US (not just Silicon Valley). Most goods are more expensive here. We do have Universal Health care, and generally good schools and Unis, it's generally safer, cops are more low key etc. etc. It's hard to compare soci…

Canadians are on average happier and live longer. I really don't see how you can argue there's a lower standard of living. Also, isn't the median household income higher in Canada than the US?

No, but they are apparently 6th and 7th with a pretty marginal difference. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income

honestly, the thing that made me question was lumping Canada in with Mexico. Not shitting on Mexico, but the standard of living there is clearly lower.

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