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The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

bloomberg.com

101–110 of 143 posts

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#101
post #78

An "innovation" ranking that doesn't have the U.S. in the top 10 is like a ranking of U.S. universities that doesn't have Harvard or Stanford in the top 10. It says more about the ranking methodology than what is being ranked.

The US appear to rank highly in the "opinion of themselves" category /s

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#102
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When casual readers see results titled "Bloomberg Innovation Index" (myself included, a while ago), there's a tendency due to brand reputation (Bloomberg!) to believe that this is some scientifically and statistically rigorous analysis of a well-defined "innovation" that can be trusted. This is dangerous, and IMO disappointing (I know, I was naive and optimistic) regarding the statistical credibility of many "reputab…

It sounds a little like denial. I mean, Bloomberg does a great job, its pretty simple: "The 2018 ranking process began with more than 200 economies. Each was scored on a 0-100 scale based on seven equally weighted categories. Nations that didn’t report data for at least six categories were eliminated". So its an equally weighted average of 7 categories. The data was reported by the nations themselves. Now the key tak…

Presumably OP is calling into question any such ranking, not just the recent ranking where the US dropped out.

> Comparatively, you can tell something is changing in the US causing a drop.

Yes, one of the factors they used to come up with this rating. Now - the question is, are those factors actually correlated with innovation?

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The US easily produces the most innovation globally As would be expected given the size of the US population. The only two more populous countries are both developing nations. But a ranking that didn't normalise over the size of the population would make even less sense than this one.

The EU is a confederation. They need to be considered as a block now. Don't look at Germany. Look at the EU.

The countries in the EU go to war independently, the states of the US do so as one. I think that's where the line goes, really.

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They should have rolled them all up into the EU. It infuriates me that no one does. Not for crime reports. Not for economic reports. The media doesn't do it right.

Does the EU? Do they produce EU-wide crime reports? EU-wide economic reports? If not, don't blame the media...

Yes, on all common metrics, in great detail: http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imo focus on output of new technologies.

I can see flaws in that potential approach too. For example, if a country has high R&D investment/capacity, but most manufacturing or commercialisation activities happen abroad, then simply measuring output of new technologies doesn't account for the R&D. Using the Bloomberg list, Austria ranks 12th overall, but 5th on R&D. Their figure is dragged down by a 26th rank in High-Tech Density. Then, Germany's High-Tech de…

Yeah that's a good point. You can look at where a company is incorporated, but they still may do R&D in different parts of the world. Could be resolved by taking the "new technologies output" of a company, but then dividing it to each country it does R&D in with proportion to the cost of that R&D.

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#107
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When casual readers see results titled "Bloomberg Innovation Index" (myself included, a while ago), there's a tendency due to brand reputation (Bloomberg!) to believe that this is some scientifically and statistically rigorous analysis of a well-defined "innovation" that can be trusted. This is dangerous, and IMO disappointing (I know, I was naive and optimistic) regarding the statistical credibility of many "reputab…

It sounds a little like denial. I mean, Bloomberg does a great job, its pretty simple: "The 2018 ranking process began with more than 200 economies. Each was scored on a 0-100 scale based on seven equally weighted categories. Nations that didn’t report data for at least six categories were eliminated". So its an equally weighted average of 7 categories. The data was reported by the nations themselves. Now the key tak…

You've hit the nail on the head I think.

It's the change in relative rankings that is the useful data from these rankings, rather than the absolute ranking.

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#108

Part of the problem, money is flowing more towards sinks like "Social Influencers", "V-loggers" and other similar jobs. Younger generation is focusing more on instant fame/money/reward/acknowledgement than investing in long term initiatives like pursuing STEM based programs. Sadly we live in a time where a 15 year old is making more money posting his/her pictures than someone holding a Phd. Forget about academia jobs…

How much actual money is flowing towards social influencers and vloggers?

It's all just advertising. Print advertising is dead (hyperbole), replaced by social advertising.

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#109

Honestly a lot of these "global" rating systems are ridiculous. The US easily produces the most innovation globally. This is similar to ranking systems that consider McGill the Harvard of Canada or consider Babson College the #1 for Entrepreneurship.

>The US easily produces the most innovation globally As would be expected given the size of the US population. The only two more populous countries are both developing nations. But a ranking that didn't normalise over the size of the population would make even less sense than this one.

Yeah, innovation levels differ much more within countries than between them. Rankings of metro areas would make more sense.

Re: The U.S. drops out of the top 10 in innovation ranking

#110
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? The original point being disputed was that SU and Soviet people "never achieved much" which is not true in many areas, one of which is becoming a militarily powerful country able to engage in a stand off with USA while 100 years ago Poland beat Soviet Russia in a war a year after gaining its own independence. Saying that "they are stupid because they were still communists" or that other countries were successful…

They did not achieve much in comparison to the rest of the world. Come on, it's obvious : - a non-hungry society? NO - wealthy society? certainly not - advanced and commercially successful airliners? no (but you'll pick a nit here, I'm sure) - advanced medicine? no (cue BS about how wonderful medicine is in Cuba, but still no) - advanced computing devices? no, certainly nothing like those available in the West by 199…

It's easy to make exclusive lists to try and make one country or another look better.

And who is the rest of the world? The USSR achieved a lot in comparison to Africa, South America, the Middle East, and SE Asia.

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