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New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

papersplease.org

101–110 of 297 posts

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#101
post #49

I don't know if it worries my American chums, but I won't visit the USA. As a foreign tourist bringing money into your economy I feel there is a very real risk to my privacy and increasingly my person. I am beginning to favour goods and services from EU where human rights still mean something. Perhaps it doesn't matter to you how the US is perceived overseas, perhaps you don't want my money. Perhaps you don't mind be…

I am an American living outside the US for ~5 years. It's become very difficult to plan for the future now that I am in a permanent relationship with a non-US citizen (we would be married already if not for the various complications associated with being different nationalities). Especially since she is from a so-called "shithole" country, one of the poorest on earth, we have doubts about whether it's even worth ever…

You should talk with your local US embassy or consulate. They can provide whatever help to clear up the process for your partner. If they are doing their job, they can greatly simplify everything. Please do not confuse the local state dept people with the shenanigans from the people at the White House...

The visa process is relative straightforward. Will the person who is given the visa come back to the country of origin? This is determined by money more often than not, and it's the harsh reality of the situation.

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#102
post #81
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if it depends on where you come from, but I went to Canada a couple years ago, by plane. No hassle at all, they just asked me if I had Malaria or knew anyone with Malaria, asked me what I was there for (Mozilla workweek, but not for work!), and they sent me on my merry way. Not even a baggage inspection, let alone a computer/cellphone inspection.

I think a lot also depends on which border guard you get and what their 'feel' for you is. I was in the US a few month ago and got waved through after 30 seconds and a couple of basic questions (might have helped that I was travelling with my wife and daughter). When I was in Canada a few years ago I got called into a separate room and asked a bunch of questions about what I do for a living, what my parents do for a…

I always felt the Canadian border questions were mostly targeted towards avoiding people coming in to take jobs that could go to Canadian locals.

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#103
post #99

I don't know if it worries my American chums, but I won't visit the USA. As a foreign tourist bringing money into your economy I feel there is a very real risk to my privacy and increasingly my person. I am beginning to favour goods and services from EU where human rights still mean something. Perhaps it doesn't matter to you how the US is perceived overseas, perhaps you don't want my money. Perhaps you don't mind be…

The rest of the world should retaliate. (...) EDIT: That was a knee-jerk reaction. Sorry about that.

I think they should only retaliate on US officials (elected and who work for DHS). Ask them to reveal passwords to national secrets when they enter the country, then detain them for hours when they refuse.

The general population should be welcomed with open arms - retaliation on them achieves nothing. It's not their fault.

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#104

I remember reading a traveller's guide to the Soviet Union, and talking about precautions you need to take while using your camera. It was written for the 1980s, I wonder if people back then would've thought, that 40 years later...

What kind of precautions did they recommend?

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#105

Unfortunately the recommended behavior is to be "difficult". Trying to somehow state your own rights, demand that officers perform searches in accordance with law etc. - which is "being difficult". If you are on your way to a great holiday, important meeting etc, you aren't going to risk it. Because anyone "being difficult" will be detained or rejected. So I'll just fold and give them my password. And they know this.…

Theres another case, though. Some people have no choice but to be "difficult". Consider, for example, a lawyer from an international firm travelling with company devices, which have on them privileged information that can under no circumstances be disclosed. These kinds of people have no choice but to be "difficult".

> These kinds of people have no choice but to be "difficult"

Then they don't get in. Things like company secrets or client-lawyer confidentiality just doesn't apply here. You have a choice to give all that up and enter, or just return.

The solution as others pointed out is not to travel with the data, but that's just cumbersome. You can always just use whatever cloud service you want, and delete the local copies, downloading the encrypted info again when you have entered the country.

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#106
post #42

Is it an option to just feign ignorance and claim not to know the password? Sure, they might confiscate it but I guess then you'll have to find a cheap alternative to restore your backups to until/if you get it back.

I think a cheaper alternative is to only allow access to non-sensitive information when initially logging into the device, then hide any substantial information behind another layer.

Don't think the average customs officer has time or skills to dig out files containing encrypted volumes on your device.

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those people don't carry that data with them, if they're competent or have competent IT staff. They have already configured VPNs with 2FA, burner laptops and mobile devices, or simply mail the devices via registered post to the hotel and have them picked up there. Device moving through the mail system don't get seen by the border grunts.

> Those people don't carry that data with them You've made a great point here. What criminal is also going to carry their incriminating data with them? This isn't an effective policy. What problem does it actually solve?

Most people, I think, don’t follow strict digital security/hygiene policies, nor understand them. That includes me, even though I try to be good. (I will not give specific details because two of my three memorable errors are currently covered by NDAs, and the third is personal).

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#109
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you just want to go to Disneyland.

Whether Disney World is worth paying for with your dignity and privacy is a decision each person must make. Further, Disney now harvest biometrics for their ticketing. Noooooooope.

Disney has an opt-out process for the fingerprint scan. (I'm not saying that to excuse their default stance, which I do find uncomfortable.)

Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices

#110
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rest of the world should retaliate. (...) EDIT: That was a knee-jerk reaction. Sorry about that.

I think they should only retaliate on US officials (elected and who work for DHS). Ask them to reveal passwords to national secrets when they enter the country, then detain them for hours when they refuse. The general population should be welcomed with open arms - retaliation on them achieves nothing. It's not their fault.

> The general population should be welcomed with open arms - retaliation on them achieves nothing. It's not their fault.

Last time I checked the US had elections, so yes, it pretty much is their fault.

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