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The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

bbc.co.uk

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Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#101

Post by seanmcdirmid »

justicezyx wrote: post #69
ShabbosGoy wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a matter of fact, China's ascending is the most peaceful and constrained among all past super powers in the world history. Alternative facts, maybe. Just look up the South China Sea, Doklam, constant agitation with India and Japan to see how peaceful China's rise is.

Well, China has solid legal ground to claim that she owns those areas. Peaceful rise does not translate to blindly avoiding conflicts.

China does not have solid legal founds for their claims, they do have a bunch of anecdotes though (e.g. The nationalists got a small USN boat to take them to visit them, so they think this means the USA must have approved of their claim).

Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#102

Post by justicezyx »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #100
justicezyx wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure what you want to say. This post is about Xi, which took office in 2012. And the aspects initiates my post is about China's recent movement to more openly show off its power. What's the point of "when they were not doing very well" in this context? > we're engaged in non peaceful activities What does this refer to?

I mean, you count China's rise as coinciding with the time just after they were being hostile to their neighbors. A rosy filter to be sure.

I said China's rise is the most peaceful among all super powers in history, I did not say that China's rise will be that it is nice to neighbors.

I also did not count any timing. I just said it's the most peaceful.

Realistically, a super power by definition means it wields more power than others, that definitely means unfriendly behavior to others, especially the neighbors. That's why China uses the word "the Great Rejuvenation of the Chinese Nation", that's both a correct and accurate slogan, and a non-aggressive way of rosy filtering what gonna happen.

Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#103

Post by [deleted] »

Iv wrote: post #64
richsinn wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the Atlantic piece is suggesting that at all. The article is making the point that the delicate power balances behind the Chinese Communist Party is very complex, and that the soundbites we hear from our Western media (or any media for that matter) probably do not capture the full extent of the power dynamics, wheeling and dealing, and inner workings of the Chinese Communist Party.

Last time I checked, the power balances are not necessarily complex, they are opaque. They could rely on tea leaves readings for all we know. Most of the "analysis" you read are pure speculations based more on wishful thinking and prejudice than on facts.

[deleted]

Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#104

Post by 68c12c16 »

forapurpose wrote: post #58
Iv wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a foreigner this feels a bit like a US' reaction about their loss of leadership. There has to be something wrong about China's rise. Imagining that it will surpass their own economic power through good management by a central government is something they just refuse to accept. It has to be some authoritarian cheat mode.

Hmmm ... that's pretty speculative, or really completely speculative. This movie has been made before. The USSR claimed something similar. Now of course, China's aggregate economy could match the U.S.'s when its citizens are only 25% as wealthy, but that is not a sign of great economic performance. > good management by a central government I think you mean by an undemocratic authoritarian government (I don't think ce…

Why has this post been downvoted so many times? Would someone who downvoted this post care to put down any word on which of those statements that you don't agree?

Sometimes the downvoting and its related visibility mechanism here really puzzles me...I really feel that perhaps we should give more weights, in terms of visibility, to those downvotes that come with even a little bit of explanation, or otherwise we are not much different from a group of mobs in the Spartan assembly (i.e. "Apella") who would consider themselves democratic and then vote by shouting loudly...

=====

PS: I am not the original poster (so in case anyone feels like to cast his downvote for the sole reason of complaining about downvoting, just go ahead and downvote mine and leave alone the OP's)...but I really don't understand (and feel a bit curious about it...) why it attracted some many downvotes, without any explicit criticism...

the reduced points really do not matter, but the reduced visibility might turn some inexperienced readers away and thus further decrease the probability of having them join in the discussion and share their perspective...

Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#105

Post by forapurpose »

68c12c16 wrote: post #104
forapurpose wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmmm ... that's pretty speculative, or really completely speculative. This movie has been made before. The USSR claimed something similar. Now of course, China's aggregate economy could match the U.S.'s when its citizens are only 25% as wealthy, but that is not a sign of great economic performance. > good management by a central government I think you mean by an undemocratic authoritarian government (I don't think ce…

Why has this post been downvoted so many times? Would someone who downvoted this post care to put down any word on which of those statements that you don't agree? Sometimes the downvoting and its related visibility mechanism here really puzzles me...I really feel that perhaps we should give more weights, in terms of visibility, to those downvotes that come with even a little bit of explanation, or otherwise we are no…

(I posted the GP.)

I can provide some hypotheses based on experience: Comments that support certain political positions are consistently downvoted. IME it happens with comments that are,

- critical of the Chinese government

- discuss Russian propaganda and trolling/astroturfing (other than to deny their existence)

- critical or questioning of the white male supremacist movement (alt-right) principles, in their propagandized 'reasonable' forms - though those comments are regularly voted back up by others; I've seen some wild fluctuations.

- critical or questioning of Elon Musk

I'm sure there are other topics that I'm not remembering. I guessed that the GP comment would be downvoted when I posted it.

Note that the first two subjects in my list have massive, well-documented online astroturfing and propaganda operations, and the third is no slouch in that area. HN policy, in kind of an odd political correctness, protects those people by forbidding any suggestion that such things are occurring - even as a possibility to consider. Don't mention the Emperor's clothes. That must make it heaven for astroturfers, propagandists, and naked Emperors everywhere.

Musk's fanboys are extreme: Drink the kool-ade or die. The man himself seems obsessed with image but enough to run an astroturfing operation? I have no knowledge that he does but would it be a surprise? Certainly he's not in the category with the other three for many very obvious reasons. For example, I hope he isn't in the dustbin of history but succeeds wildly.

Finally, the first sentence of my comment didn't help; it's a bit sharp, but that imperfection shouldn't be a big deal.

EDIT: I also wonder why alphaalpha101's comment is dead. It's not brilliant, IMHO, but certainly sufficient.

Re: The Thoughts of Chairman Xi

#106

Post by halfteatree »

justicezyx wrote: post #69
ShabbosGoy wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a matter of fact, China's ascending is the most peaceful and constrained among all past super powers in the world history. Alternative facts, maybe. Just look up the South China Sea, Doklam, constant agitation with India and Japan to see how peaceful China's rise is.

Well, China has solid legal ground to claim that she owns those areas. Peaceful rise does not translate to blindly avoiding conflicts.

>magically appearing artificial islands

>solid legal ground

one of those things has to be false.

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