These ladies are behind the times. Gender politics at Google are now so advanced that feminism isn't even a thing. The "non-binary" and "genderqueer" have thrown the feminists under the bus. Frankly I'm shocked that the informal voluntary salary survey had the bad taste to try to classify gender.
Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
101–110 of 297 posts
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#102I still wonder why the gender equality issue in nursing has not been addressed we need more men as nurses! What is it like 12 women to 1 men nurse we have to fix this its is out of hand. /s
Hahahaha it's funny because "nursing" is a gendered term for a class of front-line medical occupation that is almost certain to be vital to the provisioning of cost-effective health care in the 21st century where it is vitally important that we both raise the status of the profession to get more people into the labor force to do it and also to raise its status among consumers so less people have to wait for ludicrously expensive general practitioner doctors when a qualified nurse-practitioner will do and that's totally what you meant, right?
The best joke!
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#103I'll be shocked if its true. I'm working in the tech industry for like 13 years now, I've never heard of anyone getting a lesser pay on account of gender (at-least here in India). What has gender got to do with knowledge is beyond me !
> I've never heard of anyone getting a lesser pay on account of gender (at-least here in India)
and so you can speak for all Indians?
I have heard one of my Indian manager saying they dont prefer hiring single females who are not native to the city where they are hiring because once they get married the females would leave the city and so the company loses all that training/skills etc.
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#104Earlier quoted context omitted.
If this is a merely negotiation problem than the problem gets stated in a different tone. I have been told many times that I need to work on my negotiation skills. One manager has even asked me whom do I go lunch with. And why don't I go to eat with the big shots. Of course you need to act all pally and buttery, saying yes to anything they say all the while. What they mean to say is stop expecting the system to be fa…
A friend of mine worked for years at a firm, and did well as a salesman. But he would get overlooked for promotions. He finally figured out why. He was frugal, and would bag his lunch and eat it at his desk. The others would get together and go out for lunch. He failed to realize how much networking and business was conducted over lunch. A corollary is that working remotely is probably not a good idea if you're ambit…
>>A corollary is that working remotely is probably not a good idea if you're ambitious.
This.
And also communicating and blowing your trumpet at all opportunities available. You don't want to be overdoing it. But definitely enough of it make every one hear about you and your work.
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#105Has anything happened with the Department of Labor case recently? Last I heard, the specific organization that was pursuing the case was being defunded / split up by the current administration. It sounded like they had some interesting analysis of the data, and I don't think that's ever made it to a courtroom. I'm pretty unsurprised that leveling is a good way for bias to sneak in. My experience as a man applying for…
It's rare you'd have headcount open at L4 but not L5. There's a significant jump between levels, but not to the extent you're saying.
Leveling is a function of interviewer recommendations and hiring committee approving a candidate for a certain level. We usually interview people with a target range in mind (e.g., L4-L5) that's based on your experience and current role.
Base salaries don't have a huge range until you get very senior (e.g. Director). There's a LOT more variance in stock grants. I'm sure there are people two levels below me that have a higher overall comp due to huge stock grants.
Source: I work for Google, interview a lot, but don't serve on hiring committees. This isn't advice, and may not apply to all areas of the company.
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#106Earlier quoted context omitted.
Anecdotally, I spent a couple of months this summer going through team selection at Google NYC, with a specific request for back-end, low-level, preferably C++ roles (app security, build systems, etc.). I didn't meet or talk to a single woman through the entire process, with the exception of reception, another candidate, and someone who was covering for my recruiter when he was on vacation. I asked every manager I ta…
Your intent on joining a women-based team is very creepy/cringe. This is not a healthy behavior.
I didn't ask only about gender; I mention it because that's what the conversation above was about. I was leaving a job where the management structure had not worked well for me (nothing against the people in management, it just wasn't productive for the way I work), so all my questions were about how management worked - and in fact the remainder of my reason for turning down the job offer was that there were lots of other ways in which the management at Google didn't seem like it would work for me, much as there were lots of individual people I liked. My questions about diversity specifically included diversity of gender, race, and background (internal vs. external hires, experienced vs. new hires, etc.), and in part I was listening for how they would answer more than what they answered.
My current team at the company I ended up joining, as it happens, has no women, so this clearly isn't a dealbreaker for me - but I was much more convinced by the quality of management on several axes.
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#107I still wonder why the gender equality issue in nursing has not been addressed we need more men as nurses! What is it like 12 women to 1 men nurse we have to fix this its is out of hand. /s
Hahahaha it's funny because "nursing" is a gendered term for a class of front-line medical occupation that is almost certain to be vital to the provisioning of cost-effective health care in the 21st century where it is vitally important that we both raise the status of the profession to get more people into the labor force to do it and also to raise its status among consumers so less people have to wait for ludicrous…
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Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#108I still wonder why the gender equality issue in nursing has not been addressed we need more men as nurses! What is it like 12 women to 1 men nurse we have to fix this its is out of hand. /s
I don't know if you are trying to be sarcastic, but this is a very hot topic in the nursing field. https://www.nurse.com/blog/2017/03/17/making-the-case-for-mo...
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
What percentage of HIGH PAY ENGINEERING jobs in google have comp sci degrees, that's the true comparison. And then there is bigger issue here. It's really the obsession about percentages of women in X position. Here's another percentage what percentage of women and men didn't waste a thought on how they looked in their teenage years because they where so obsessed on how computers worked? I believe it is both very sma…
>>Here's another percentage what percentage of women and men didn't waste a thought on how they looked in their teenage years because they where so obsessed on how computers worked? Most people are not in the job because they like create things or build things. They are there because they want a job and nothing more. And they want a job where (unit of money)/(unit of work) has a higher value. That means they have to…
I find it interesting that HN commenters frequently take it for granted that someone who tinkered with programming at an early age and do side projects is a better performer at work.
I have never seen any multiple-data-point evidence presented to support it. Sure, various prominent entrepreneurs used computers as hobbyists (Gates, Zuckerberg), but does that apply to the typical programmer?
We all encountered students in classes who didn't study yet completely grokked their mathematics and algorithms coursework. Why is it so hard to believe that those quick learners use their time effectively at work?
Additionally, a multiplier to good engineering is strong communication and organizational skills; those can be enhanced through social recreational activity, and diminished by spending leisure time in solitude.
I'm not claiming either method is better, and intuitively the passionate engineer should win, but we shouldn't take it for granted until we get some actual information.
Edit: there seems to be some belief that I don't value experience. It is extremely important. We just shouldn't take it for granted that programming at home is as valuable as work experience.
Re: Google Sued by 3 Female Ex-Employees Who Say It Pays Women Less Than Men
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Sometimes we might not get what we deserve. Sometimes we deserve less than others. Gender/etc aside, some people are less talented/effective. Society seems to be afraid to say this, but not everyone is created equal upstairs. > They both had four years experience. Obviously, on the job years is almost entirely unrelated to pre-work experience, so this is just silly. I hope there's more to it. I'm curious how their…
Thanks for making these points explicit. Years experience is not an indicator of seniority. I have two friends that graduated at different years. One has more than 10 years experience. The other has three years. 10 year guy has been working with jquery and HTML the whole time. He avoids any other problems or domains. Three year guy wants to work in every area possible. He actively pursues internships and work that pr…
> Now who do you think is more valuable as an employee?
For which job? For some breadth of experience would be better but for a job working with html+jquery all day every day the depth of experience in that area would be preferred. Sadly the industry seems to be too focused on "full-stack" interchangeable components lately.