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ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

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Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#101

Post by intopieces »

the_stc wrote: post #87
intopieces wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are never anonymous when you connect to the Internet, even over Tor, even through 7 proxies. There is always a connection right back to you. We need to move beyond the obsession with anonymity and refocus the goal as being privacy. Then, recognize that privacy has several levels. That way, the expectation is more clear.

This is disingenuous. Bitcoin is very anti-anonymous. Tor is rather anonymous. Saying that perfect anonymity does not exist because there's always some bits leaking to an omniscient entity is not helpful. ProtonMail should support Monero. For now, I pay using a group of Monero wallets I churn every few hours and xmr.to. I suppose Bitcoin is the least common denominator in that sense.

>Bitcoin is very anti-anonymous.

That's correct. It is very anti-anonymous by its design; its security rests everyone verifying the transactions. The distinction you make is the same one I attempt to make by arguing against anonymity as a goal. Both Bitcoin and Tor are, in the mind of the public, construed as ways to be anonymous on the Internet. That is dangerous.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#102

Post by jameskegel »

vabmit wrote: post #49
jameskegel wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No this is the incorrect answer. Mixers congest the network and cause many unneeded fees and they are NOT future proof and do NOT deliver suddenly-fungible bitcoins at the other end. Use Monero, not ZCash, not DASH with a special type of transaction, use MONERO with genuine ring confidential transactions. RingCT - https://lab.getmonero.org/pubs/MRL-0005.pdf Monero vs ZCash vs Mixers - https://moneroforcash.com/monero…

We will hopefully support ZCash in the future. But, unfortunately, we don't right now. I am a member of the ZCash forum, though. I have been keeping a close watch on the project/coin and am very impressed with it. I don't know anything about Monero. I either hadn't heard of it before or just didn't give it any attention after seeing it because of the flood of coins lately. Thanks for the pointer and endorsement of it…

ZCash is not Monero, is not fungible, and does not have complete privacy. I was very clear about this distinction in the previous post because ZCash is not the right answer, and every time something is said about Monero the next comment agrees about everything that makes Monero valuable, and then goes on to talk about ZCash as if the two are interchangeable. This is a false equivalence that can confuse readers who don't care to research better.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#103

Post by icebraining »

sdotsen wrote: post #28
csomar wrote: post #13

This is a little bit "late". Fastmail has supported Bitcoin payment for a very long time. In fact, I was surprised last year when I wanted to try proton mail and they didn't have Bitcoin payments.

So you couldn't just use a CC or some other form of payment? Seriously?

As amazing as it may sound to you, much of population of the world doesn't have a CC. And not everyone trusts or likes to support Paypal.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#104

Post by mandie »

vabmit wrote: post #40
blunte wrote: post #32

More "progress" from ProtonMail, while they still provide no way to export emails in bulk. They recommend you forward every individual email or print it. The Export feature has been an open request since before March 2015. Another feature which would give users a way to get their mail out of PM is the ability to check mail from a client like Outlook or Thunderbird. That has been an open feature request since before F…

Try to relax a bit. It is good for your health. :) Both of those features are under development. If you would like to see them sooner rather than later, perhaps you know some great programmers that you could recommend to careers@protonmail.ch? Or, you could share ProtonMail's Careers page: https://protonmail.com/careers ProtonMail is hiring!

You're charging people for a service, you're in no position to treat anybody like that.

Translation: please don't be a dumbass.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#106

Post by icebraining »

thinbeige wrote: post #79
ringaroundthetx wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

everyone that pays with bitcoin now that everything is cheaper? yeah it goes counter to all of the anti-deflationary schools of economics, but when have economists ever gotten actual human behavior right?

Nobody does. And this is the problem with having no inflation. Every economy needs a slight inflation, otherwise people stop consuming, instead save all their money and it gets worse => deflation. Bitcoin equals gold, nobody uses Bitcoin to consume anything. I don't know which human behavior you refer to.

Every economy needs a slight inflation, otherwise people stop consuming, instead save all their money and it gets worse => deflation.

That's the claim, where's the evidence?

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#107

Post by sauronlord »

Accacin wrote: post #82
mi100hael wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes the customer is either flat wrong or at least an asshole. ProtonMail sends yearly surveys to paying customers asking for help prioritizing development efforts, so suggesting they don't listen to their customers is asinine. IMAP support is in beta as a result of customers prioritizing it in those surveys. As they are likely limited primarily by funding and developer bandwidth, I see nothing wrong with their…

Fair point, but exporting email? These aren't crazy ideas from one person's wishlist. These are actual features that should be standard for any company providing an email service.

Gmail is pretty good at exporting your e-mail straight to the NSA too.

Maybe if Protonmail receives some kickbacks from the NSA, then they could implement the feature for you as a FREE user.

Oh, you're a paying customer? Then I guess their lack of export shows you how valuable their service is inspite of that feature being unavailable.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#108

Post by ThePhysicist »

mi100hael wrote: post #78
andrewvc wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great example of how not to interact with customers. Telling a customer who's been waiting on a feature for over a year to relax is just insulting. I picked Fastmail due to their excellent support reputation, you all could learn from them!

Sometimes the customer is either flat wrong or at least an asshole. ProtonMail sends yearly surveys to paying customers asking for help prioritizing development efforts, so suggesting they don't listen to their customers is asinine. IMAP support is in beta as a result of customers prioritizing it in those surveys. As they are likely limited primarily by funding and developer bandwidth, I see nothing wrong with their…

Exporting e-mails was one of the most requested features as far as I remember (https://protonmail.com/support/knowledge-base/export-import-...) and I can understand people getting angry about this. I think Protonmail will have to move a bit faster on this now as holding your customer data "hostage" will no longer be an acceptable practice starting from next year (May 25) due to EU GDPR. So if they want to keep selling to EU customers they will have to implement a mechanism to allow people to get their data out of their system in an automated way.

And honestly, e-mail is not only about communication but also about archiving of data, and what good is an archive if you can't even get the data out of it when you need it? I've been a Protonmail premium subscriber and I would have loved to stay on their service, but the fact of not being able to get my e-mails out of there in case I needed them made it totally unsuitable as a business e-mail account.

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#109

Post by sauronlord »

mandie wrote: post #104
vabmit wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try to relax a bit. It is good for your health. :) Both of those features are under development. If you would like to see them sooner rather than later, perhaps you know some great programmers that you could recommend to careers@protonmail.ch? Or, you could share ProtonMail's Careers page: https://protonmail.com/careers ProtonMail is hiring!

You're charging people for a service, you're in no position to treat anybody like that. Translation: please don't be a dumbass.

How ironic that you're tone is worse that OP and then you call them a vulgar name.

Your point is lost because the emphasis you gain is precisely because of your shitty tone.

Maybe protonmail doesn't give a fuck. I'm more inclined to now apply to them as a developer and think that "they just get it".

I'm a paying customer and found their reply humorous.

People have such thin skins these days....

Re: ProtonMail Now Supports Bitcoin Payments

#110

Post by rodrigoavie »

cal5k wrote: post #90
rodrigoavie wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protonmail fan and user here. Guys, honestly there are better ways to respond to customers and potential customers, without the patronizing tone. That can't possibly help.

It actually didn't seem idiomatic... I suspect that english is not their first language and they might not have realized they were being rude.

Funny, I thought about that too right after I wrote my comment.
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