Live data from Hacker News

The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

propublica.org

101–110 of 275 posts

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#101
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, that's a big part of it. It's a simple rule that's easy to follow, which can often be better in terms of health overall.

Yeah unless we put something better in place, maybe a dedicated QR code website to quickly verify if that box is 1, 2, 10, toxic

It seems like you could use that same space for the QR code to just specify its toxicity.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#102

> The findings surprised both researchers: A dozen of the 14 compounds were still as potent as they were when they were manufactured, some at almost 100 percent of their labeled concentrations. What kind of reporting is this? Anything less than 100% is not "as potent as when manufactured", and the sentence implies some of those dozen weren't close to 100%. > The idea that drugs expire on specified dates goes back at…

I wonder for certain drugs how much of a difference 98% potency is vs 100%. Surely that 2% must matter. Also, what does it mean to be less potent? It's still the same drug right? So does that just mean the pill contains less of it somehow?

I'm pretty sure for almost all drugs 20% doesn't matter. Think about it. I've never gotten an over the counter or prescription drug that was adjusted for my weight. The closest thing I can think of is painkillers (tylenol, etc) giving different dosages for children.

So if a 110lb wife gets the same dosage as a 200lb husband, how on earth would even a 20% difference in dosage amount make a big difference?

2% can only be done in fantasyland, like in a hospital you and the medicine are both closely weighed and administered.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#103

"Berkowitz picks up a box of sodium bicarbonate, which is crucial for heart surgery and to treat certain overdoses. It’s being rationed because there’s so little available." Huh? US hospitals have a shortage of Baking Soda ?

Oh yes... it's a pain in the ass. Recently in the news, too [1]. There weren't many days where the hospitals I've worked at weren't short on something . (And these are like, big name academic medical centers in big U.S. cities.) I've run into a shortage of normal saline before. Yes... salt water. Sometimes hospitals will even stockpile basic supplies to keep from running into shortages... which only makes the whole s…

Remove patent protection for any drugs that are in shortage.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#104

Degraded tetracycline has been documented to be dangerous in those who are suffering from renal failure. There's also the possibility that a person may be suffering from a new undiagnosed condition, which hadn't yet onset when they were initially prescribed the drug. In this case you could think of it less as an expiration for the drug, and more of a suggestion to seek additional medical guidance on continuing after…

3 cases in 50 years? That's all you've got?

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah unless we put something better in place, maybe a dedicated QR code website to quickly verify if that box is 1, 2, 10, toxic

It seems like you could use that same space for the QR code to just specify its toxicity.

not web enough

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#106
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, that's a big part of it. It's a simple rule that's easy to follow, which can often be better in terms of health overall.

Yeah unless we put something better in place, maybe a dedicated QR code website to quickly verify if that box is 1, 2, 10, toxic

But there are too many details in how the drug could fail depending on its individual storage.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder for certain drugs how much of a difference 98% potency is vs 100%. Surely that 2% must matter. Also, what does it mean to be less potent? It's still the same drug right? So does that just mean the pill contains less of it somehow?

I'm pretty sure for almost all drugs 20% doesn't matter. Think about it. I've never gotten an over the counter or prescription drug that was adjusted for my weight. The closest thing I can think of is painkillers (tylenol, etc) giving different dosages for children. So if a 110lb wife gets the same dosage as a 200lb husband, how on earth would even a 20% difference in dosage amount make a big difference? 2% can only…

> I've never gotten an over the counter or prescription drug that was adjusted for my weight.

How do you know that your doctor didn't take your weight into consideration when selecting the dose for a prescription medicine?

OTC drugs are often generally provided at a dose that should be safe for most adults, but may be significantly different in effectiveness based on weight.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#109

This article has some shoddy logic. For the vast majority of drugs, the actual marginal manufacturing price per pill is essentially zero. That means that when the expired pills are thrown away and new pills are manufactured, there is no true economic loss. Rather, all that potentially happens is a transfer between the consumer and the manufacturer. If pill prices were set by some external force, this could at least b…

Your logic would be fine if manufacturers were required to replace expired pills with new ones. But they aren't, so early expiry dates impose enormous economic costs on consumers of drugs, while manufacturers get the massive benefits of selling drugs twice to same consumer.

A lot of manufacturers accept expired drug. And even if they don't, distributors often do as well.

And expired drugs comes down to inventory management. Don't buy more product than you can sell.

Re: The Myth of Drug Expiration Dates

#110

Almost all of the drugs I have in my cabinet are expired, and all have been 100% potent as the day I got it when I needed to take it years later. I have known this for a long time. There is also a reason the expiration date on your prescriptions is exactly one year after you get it from the pharmacy, when those bottles are actually sitting in a different bottle for months and months at the pharmacy. The entire reason…

For prescription drugs in the hands of consumers, as opposed to hospitals and pharmacies, I would be concerned about consumers misusing drugs.

For example, suppose someone goes to their doctor with certain symptoms and are diagnosed with a specific condition. They are prescribed a drug to treat it. They use up half the prescription, and the condition goes away.

A couple years later they develop similar symptoms. Instead of going to the doctor and getting diagnosed they just assume that it is the same thing the had before, and so start taking the drug again.

If they are right, great. They have saved the time and cost of a doctor visit. But what if they are not right? What if this time they have something different that just shares some major symptoms with the prior illness, but that needs a different treatment? Worse, it could even turn out that the side effects of the drug make what they have this time worse.

Post reply on HN