NeoVim 0.2.0 released • Hacker News Board

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#101

Post by voidz » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:15 PM UTC

The only thing that bugs me about neovim is that it seems to require workarounds to get the escape button to behave the same as in vim. When I press escape to exit insert mode, there is a small delay. If I press a key (e.g. 'j' to go down) too quickly after Escape, it inserts the 'j' and cancels what escape is meant to do.

In tmux I know of a workaround (iirc, 'set escape-delay 0' or something similar), but I wish I didn't have to change a tmux setting so one program can function. It's really annoying.. but ultimately worth it, I guess.

That said — to the neovim team: congratulations on reaching the 2.0 milestone!

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#102

Post by pekk » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:21 PM UTC

monzee wrote: post #52

adrianN wrote: post #4

I'm currently using vim and I'm quite happy with it. I don't use many plugins, so better support for plugins is not very helpful to me. Are there other reasons why I should switch to Neovim?

Faster startup, mouse works as you'd expect in a regular desktop app. Switch panes, tabs, open new tab, scroll panes, resize panes, select ranges, all in the terminal. I know not using the mouse is one of the reasons why one would choose vim, but the mouse really is faster/more intuitive in some situations.

I can already use the mouse normally in vim... is it that the configuration is too hard?

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#103

Post by baldfat » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:23 PM UTC

Trd wrote: post #80

baldfat wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found the fork / refactor of VIM by NeoVIM to be very hostile and even naming itself "New Vim" made me not want to support NeoVIM. I have been using VIM since it was on my Amiga in the mid 90s. VIM has been a stellar project that is due a lot of respect. Even the funding for VIM is reflected back to giving to Uganda children charity. > NeoVim exists at all is because Bram Moolenaar refused to accept any patches for…

It's offensive for neovim to call itself neovim but it's alright for vim to be called vim? For the record, vim means Vi iMproved. Bill Joy invented Vi, not braam. Neovim is very much to vim what vim was to Vi. And Vi is what should be credited for the more important concepts found in those editors and their reproduction in IDE like the various Vi like plugins. Braam losing a spiritual monopoly on such a great editor…

Your wrong in terms of how VIM came about and name.

VIM originally meant "Vi IMitation". It wasn't till 1993 that it became "Vi Improved."

Actually VIM is not a direct fork of VI. VIM comes from Stevie editor from Atari ST and Amiga days. (I actually started with Stevie).

Here is the tree from ed to VIM

ed > Bill Joy and company then made em > en > ex AKA vi

Joy left development of VI in June 1979 and joined corporate life working with BSD.

vi (Unix\BSD) > Stevie editor (Atari ST) > VIM (Amiga)

Then chaos hit. From 1981 onward clones and implementations were incompatible and progress kind of grind to a halt due to license. That is when Stevie editor hit and then when Bram Moolenaar made VIM. He reimplimented it for Amiga and added features one being plugins. Vi had no plugins and very little customization.

Here is why your analogy is wrong: LICENSING "While commercial vendors could work with Bill Joy's codebase (and continue to use it today), many people could not. Because Joy had begun with Ken Thompson's ed editor, ex and vi were derivative works and could not be distributed except to people who had an AT&T source license."

So it is not at all like this fork. I find that people have taken sides without even knowing the history of VIM and make assumptions.

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#104

Post by pekk » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:26 PM UTC

vajrapani666 wrote: post #50

kerny wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you back up this claim? I think it's not true and authors of both projects respect each other. They simply have different views regarding backwards compatibility etc.

I think 'hostile' is a bit harsh. I'd say 'infinitely reticent to large changes'. All the neovim authors wanted, was a list of blockers needed to merge their async patch. Bram would never give them that, always coming up with one more change. I've seen this pattern of infinite reluctance before, especially when communities depend heavily on one maintainer. its not about async and the specific semantics of the patch a…

All they wanted was to fork the project to "clean up" the code in ways they wanted, manage the community themselves, etc. It wasn't like all their patches were flawless and Bram just wouldn't accept them.

Just dumping any old code into a project the first time it's demanded is a sign not of enlightened maintenance but of gross negligence. It's good if there's a lot of feedback on patches, it's not some kind of aggression.

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#105

Post by voidz » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:26 PM UTC

pmoriarty wrote: post #88

lunixbochs wrote: post #73

This release fixes one of the biggest bugs with asynchronously embedding Neovim (some input states would just block the API), and makes ActualVim more reliable as a result. Neovim embedding works pretty well now, and will only get better. I'm hoping it will be possible soon to embed the entire Vim experience into another editor with little to no tradeoffs on either side. I've been impressed when interacting with the…

I'd love to see neovim embedded in Firefox, and have it be just a standard part of every text field. Having a seperate editor window pop up as with the It's All Text extension is just not the same. It'd also be great if there was a way to have neovim "wrap" arbitrary shell commands, kind of like rlwrap[1] does, only with full vim editing features available instead of the relatively crippled readline. [1] - http://uto…

I wish something like this were available for Chrome. My Firefox use has been declining. Not really sure why. Though the termination of the addons language (xul?) in favor of webextensions is probably a big reason.

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#106

Post by pekk » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:27 PM UTC

garou wrote: post #59

The efforts of Neovim team are well-intentioned and we are seeing it shaking the ViM development. (the previous major version from (7.0) 2006, before it (6.0) 2001). We love updates after all.

I wouldn't read too much into changes of version numbers. vim was being updated continuously.

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#107

Post by executesorder66 » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:28 PM UTC

mundanevoice wrote: post #94

executesorder66 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main reason NeoVim exists at all is because Bram Moolenaar refused to accept any patches for async support. People already did the work for him and he didn't want it. So they decided to write their own text editor that supported async plugins. Bram got butthurt and didn't want to lose a large portion of his user base, so he added async support. NeoVim's first public release (version 0.1) was released in December…

> The main reason NeoVim exists at all is because Bram Moolenaar refused to accept any patches for async support. People already did the work for him and he didn't want it. This is not true. If the work was not complete and not as how the lead maintainer/developer wants it. It is highly unlikely that it would be merged. I suggest you actually go and read the mailing list when this happened. I have seen it.

If I remember correctly, the guy kept changing his patch to meet Bram's conditions, but then Bram kept adding more requirements, to the point where it seemed like Bram was just making up excuses for not accepting the patch.

I could be wrong though. Please can you link the mailing list. (I can't find it) I'll read it and take back what I said, if that is the case.

Edit: spelling

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#108

Post by numeromancer » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:30 PM UTC

seren wrote: post #97

hestefisk wrote: post #95

Any reports on how stable the Windows release is?

I don't know if it'an issue on my side, but I have not manage to do anything with the :terminal on Windows 7. It starts a prompt but I can not input anything in Terminal mode. I tried 'i' to go in insert mode in the terminal but it does not seem to work either. (To be sure this is not something in my vimrc, I tried with and without it). At that point I am not sure if this is a problem between chair and keyboard or a…

- Download and extract neovim win64 package

- Start nvim-qt.exe

- Get message box saying "The Neovim process has crashed"

- Go back to Vim

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#109

Post by hammerandtongs » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:39 PM UTC

voidz wrote: post #105

pmoriarty wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to see neovim embedded in Firefox, and have it be just a standard part of every text field. Having a seperate editor window pop up as with the It's All Text extension is just not the same. It'd also be great if there was a way to have neovim "wrap" arbitrary shell commands, kind of like rlwrap[1] does, only with full vim editing features available instead of the relatively crippled readline. [1] - http://uto…

I wish something like this were available for Chrome. My Firefox use has been declining. Not really sure why. Though the termination of the addons language (xul?) in favor of webextensions is probably a big reason.

Re: NeoVim 0.2.0 released

#110

Post by garou » Tue, May 02, 2017, 4:57 PM UTC

pekk wrote: post #106

garou wrote: post #59

The efforts of Neovim team are well-intentioned and we are seeing it shaking the ViM development. (the previous major version from (7.0) 2006, before it (6.0) 2001). We love updates after all.

I wouldn't read too much into changes of version numbers. vim was being updated continuously.

The versions numbers talk about the changes happening and compatibility. There's just a few new features in the 7.3 [1]:

Persistent undo, More encryption, Conceal text, Lua interface, Python3 interface.

[1] http://vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/version7.html