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Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

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Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#101

Post by jamessb »

kristjankalm wrote: post #84
drdeca wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think "gaining half a bit of information" about something can correspond to stuff that lets you update your probability distribution about it? I'm not sure.

yes, but your gain is still an integer number. the non-integer ratio is just a statistic (gain per number of units).

Why is it an integer number?

Entropy (in bits) is defined as - \sum_x (p(x) log_2 p(x))

There is no reason this has to be an integer, since probabilities are not restricted to being reciprocals of powers of 2.

Consider also that you can simply use a different logarithm base to get a different unit (e.g. use the natural logarithm to obtain the entropy in nats). It would be bizarre if the arbitrary choice of 2 as the base gave a unit that was indivisible.

I think this whole confusion comes down to the difference between a bit as a "unit of information in the sense of information theory" [divisible] and a bit as a "single physical one or zero" [not divisible]. The relationship between the two is that the entropy of a random variable is a lower bound on the average number of bits required to represent it.

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#102

Post by masklinn »

rincebrain wrote: post #91
bdash wrote: post #3

Note that the size increase is in the _bitcode_ portion of the binary. This slice is stripped from the binary before it makes it to the user's device. This means the size increase is merely an inconvenience during the development process, and has no impact on the size of apps as users see them.

As [1] points out above, while the largest increase is in the bitcode, it's still a 2.2x increase in the non-bitcode portions of the binary. [1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13993961

And the 2.2x non-bitcode increase seems consistent with adomanico's report of a 2~3x increase of "App Store File Sizes" as reported by iTunes Connect: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13992107

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#104

Post by JustSomeNobody »

alimbada wrote: post #86
DannyBee wrote: post #5

This appears to be bitcode. It probably means they just starting making use of more metadata or something that is now included in the bitcode. Bitcode also now deliberately trades off size vs speed and includes indexes used for LTO, etc. They could be including those. You should almost always expect bitcode to get beat by "llvm-dis|xz", because the goal of bitcode is not to be the most compact possible format, but in…

The iOS Gmail app has increased in size to 140MB at the last update. I'm on a 16GB iPhone and I've noticed app sizes slowly increasing over the last two and a half years that I've had my phone. I have to keep an eye on app size to make sure I don't run out of space on my phone. I've already boycotted the Facebook app, but apps like Gmail are too important to uninstall. If it comes to it I'll be getting rid of a lot o…

Features mostly. I mean, you seem to absolutely need the Gmail app. While I, too, have a Gmail account, I like the simplicity of the native mail app in iOS. I don't need any additional features. I get mail, I read mail, I can write mail.

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#105

Post by mwexler »

So, the app explodes in size, and since almost no app provides a "clear cache/temp" feature, apps grow til you are crashing routinely. While iOS may clear some space when it feels like it, I have a monthly routine of deleting and reinstalling a slew of apps which take up gigs of space on the device after usage, even though they are just showing data stored on a server. I know, I shouldn't have to worry about this, that iOS will eventually clean it up... but when apps are crashing b/c they can't get space, I wind up having to manually step in.

So, a) for devs, if you think your app caches, provide a way to clear it (look at Opera's Coast browser, who puts it in the Settings app), and b) for users, if you think you are out of space, look at apps and compare app size to total space, and you'll find some hogs.

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#106

Post by Nexxxeh »

alien3d wrote: post #78
0x0 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's probably because the app store may offer a delta update patch instead of a full download.

i prefer to knew more about it.. but seem here down vote making me sad those coward downvoter.. maybe i will close this account..

I didn't downvote you, but I can help you understand why you were downvoted.

On HN, you'll usually get an answer if you ask a question.

"Is x going to be a problem for y?"

Making an incorrect statement however will get you downvoted.

"x will be a problem for y."

The other issue is your writing quality. You will get better results if you put more effort into your writing.

You don't have to have perfect English. Many people on HN have English as a second language.

Things like a capital letters at the start of a sentence, and using single full stops (periods) at the end of sentences, show effort. You will find people will be more tolerant of grammar issues if you at least put effort into the basics.

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#107

Post by tqkxzugoaupvwqr »

alimbada wrote: post #86
DannyBee wrote: post #5

This appears to be bitcode. It probably means they just starting making use of more metadata or something that is now included in the bitcode. Bitcode also now deliberately trades off size vs speed and includes indexes used for LTO, etc. They could be including those. You should almost always expect bitcode to get beat by "llvm-dis|xz", because the goal of bitcode is not to be the most compact possible format, but in…

The iOS Gmail app has increased in size to 140MB at the last update. I'm on a 16GB iPhone and I've noticed app sizes slowly increasing over the last two and a half years that I've had my phone. I have to keep an eye on app size to make sure I don't run out of space on my phone. I've already boycotted the Facebook app, but apps like Gmail are too important to uninstall. If it comes to it I'll be getting rid of a lot o…

I use the built-in Mail app on macOS and iOS for Gmail accounts. Works well. If you need space, you should give it a try.

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#108

Post by aaronfuqua »

Isn't 10.3 the first version that is introducing the new APFS file system? If so, couldn't that have something to do with it? Does each app need to compile for both supported file systems now? I am not a LLVM expert but someone with more expertise on this subject might be able to say. I just found it odd that no one else here had mentioned it. It is the big update for 10.3

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#109

Post by tripzilch »

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #104
alimbada wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The iOS Gmail app has increased in size to 140MB at the last update. I'm on a 16GB iPhone and I've noticed app sizes slowly increasing over the last two and a half years that I've had my phone. I have to keep an eye on app size to make sure I don't run out of space on my phone. I've already boycotted the Facebook app, but apps like Gmail are too important to uninstall. If it comes to it I'll be getting rid of a lot o…

Features mostly. I mean, you seem to absolutely need the Gmail app. While I, too, have a Gmail account, I like the simplicity of the native mail app in iOS. I don't need any additional features. I get mail, I read mail, I can write mail.

you can't fill 140MB with "features mostly".

it's gotta be something like mostly media (uncompressed bitmaps), metadata, (debug symbols maybe?), libraries / platform / compatibility layers (95% of which is never used for any particular install).

I have seen what it looks like when you actually try to cram "features mostly" into a few tens of megabytes and the GMail app is not that.

source: the demoscene

Re: Xcode 8.3 produces binaries 3x larger than Xcode 8.2.1

#110

Post by alimbada »

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #104
alimbada wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The iOS Gmail app has increased in size to 140MB at the last update. I'm on a 16GB iPhone and I've noticed app sizes slowly increasing over the last two and a half years that I've had my phone. I have to keep an eye on app size to make sure I don't run out of space on my phone. I've already boycotted the Facebook app, but apps like Gmail are too important to uninstall. If it comes to it I'll be getting rid of a lot o…

Features mostly. I mean, you seem to absolutely need the Gmail app. While I, too, have a Gmail account, I like the simplicity of the native mail app in iOS. I don't need any additional features. I get mail, I read mail, I can write mail.

> I get mail, I read mail, I can write mail.

That's exactly what the Gmail app does too. What other features does it offer that the Mail app doesn't? If none, then why does it need to be so huge?

I picked on Gmail because it's the most recent culprit that I have noticed creeping (sometimes jumping) up in app size but it isn't the only one guilty of this. Like I said in my original comment, the Reddit app is 13MB and does a bit more than the Gmail app. I can read/write posts and comments and view images; similar features to Gmail, but I can also watch gifs and videos. Can someone explain why there is an order of magnitude of discrepancy between the two apps sizes?

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