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SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

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Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#101

Post by qrendel »

kauffj wrote: post #55

It's ironic that Keller will get so much shit dumped on him for making the same exact argument that people make against more permissive immigration. Compare: A : Allowing people trapped in unproductive countries to move to US/Canada/Europe would significantly improve their quality of life. B : But think of burden to the welfare state! We wouldn't be able to afford the flood of people moving here for benefits. A : Sim…

To add to that hypocrisy, there's also the outrage when jobs go to the most impoverished in other countries, rather than be given to comparatively wealthy westerners at the expense of both the companies and foreign communities.

If you're single w/ no dependents and making $54k or more a year, you are already in the top 1% of the global population by income.[1] Makes a lot of the anti-1% stuff come off as extremely hypocritical.

[1] https://www.givingwhatwecan.org/get-involved/how-rich-am-i/

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#102

Post by DanBC »

Coding_Cat wrote: post #46
discardorama wrote: post #35

I think he does have a point... but he could have put it better. I live in SF too; for ~10 years. I have never seen it this bad. The City passed a "sit/lie" law a couple of years ago.. but it's never enforced. The City is spending $1M/month ... for housing 225 people[1]. Do the math, and you'll see how ridiculous is that. At that rate, how much do you think the City can spend on the homeless? It has 7000 homeless, an…

>You can't force them to use detox clinics, etc. Maybe it is not possible yet legally, but why shouldn't we allow this? The courts can already force people to be commited for mental afflictions when they are a danger to themselves or others. Why not do the same for (heavy) drug addicts who start becoming a liability?

It doesn't work unless the person wants to recover. That's apart from the human rights violation.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#103

Post by erroneousfunk »

So this guy went to school, worked hard, and now makes enough money to pay rent and feed himself in one of the most expensive cities in the US. small golf clap

His main fault here is assuming that this also means, while ironically citing free market economics, that he's rich enough to have some sort of right not to see homelessness, mental illness, and poverty, day to day. That's a whole other level of wealth and power right there. Mid-priced (in San Francisco, anyway) restaurant? $20 theater tickets? That gives him some sort of insulating privilege from life? If you're Barack Obama, yes, the intrusion of a drug-addled crazy person bursting past secret service and into the restaurant you're dining in may be cause of serious concern. If you're a Saudi oil merchant, you can pay to stay at and go to places with tighter security, or bring your own. Heck, you can afford move to and work from areas with fewer of these problems in the first place, commuting around on your own private jet, being carefully shuttled from one multi-million dollar private residence to the other.

Your personal wealth doesn't give you the right to see and interact only with people who are within your same circles of success. If you want to start judging the personal success of others, holding yourself above them, and claiming your right to class insularity, there are probably some billionaires out there who would laugh in your face, if they cared enough, which they don't, because they'd rather they didn't see you at all.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#104

Post by monkmartinez »

creshal wrote: post #66
monkmartinez wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a complex issue... but in my experience, most of the homeless are not looking for help to find jobs and/or contribute to society in manner that will lead them out of "homelessness." A lot of them prefer this "lifestyle"... we try very hard to help the people that want help. Most don't. Go talk to your local EMS/Fire department personnel and most of them will have similar stories. I know the homeless people in…

> A lot of them prefer this "lifestyle"... we try very hard to help the people that want help. Most don't. A lot of them are mentally handicapped or dealing with acquired mental illnesses. Even under good conditions, treating either is hard . Of course EMS/fire fighters/volunteers working in shelters aren't able to do that.

I've loaded many a homeless into my fire engine to take to the local Crisis Resource Center/ Behaviour Rehabilitation center because they begged and pleaded that they want help. Great!

More often than not, we see them a few days later with Steel Reserve cans littered about after someone calls 911 for what appears to them a dead man on the side of the road.

Mental illness is brutal. I feel for these guys, especially as I get older and start seeing my age equivalent homeless folks with PTSD and the like. The Vietnam vets are being replaced with Gulf war and Afghanistan vets. It is heart breaking to be sure... especially because many of us have served. We try, again, to hook these guys up with the VA... but they must want the help. It will not work otherwise.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#105

Post by StavrosK »

marbletiles wrote: post #69
StavrosK wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The GP didn't say the letter meant it that way, he said the letter is right in that there shouldn't be homeless people living in the streets, they should be taken care of by a stronger safety net.

I'm going to be pedantic, but only because I think that's how the letter guy is going to try and get out of this too. The letter did not say that "there shouldn't be homeless people living in the streets". Both it and GP said he shouldn't have to see homeless people. The letter writer certainly wouldn't care if the homeless people were still homeless, so long as they were bussed somewhere he didn't have to gaze upon…

Or if he went blind!

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#106

Post by jakejake »

Well like many people, this guy is pointing out a true and real problem. SF is a world class city but there are an unusually high number of drug addicts and homeless people walking the streets. But the author lacks any understanding of the root causes and, comically doesn't see his own role in the problem.

None of us like seeing homeless people but the problem is not that they are unsightly or annoying - the problem is why are they homeless to begin with and what is such a wealthy city doing to help? If you're only thinking of your own selfish needs then it makes sense to just "sweep up" people on the streets and send them somewhere out of site. Perhaps a good whack on the head with a night stick will dissuade them from returning. If you have no heart or compassion then it probably seems like a great idea. But if you have any sense at all then perhaps you can try to use some of your privilege to find real solutions to homelessness and perhaps lend a hand rather than try to swat them away.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#107

Post by cooper12 »

sandworm101 wrote: post #31

The shame is that this individual is far from unique, and not just in SF. I run into people daily who speak of homelessness as a conscious lifestyle choice. I know of one SF attorney who constantly rants about how the homeless there all earn 50k a year. They build up these fantasy worlds to justify their perception of themselves as moral millionaires. They believe wealth to be the inevitable result of a heightened mo…

Yep I also hate this narrative of how every homeless person is a lazy drug addict or has mental issues.[0] While I'm sure many of them do suffer from these problems, it's indicative of a failure in social support systems to deal with that. Also, receiving "handouts" is an indicator of higher moral character in my opinion; I'd love to see one of these types try to beg in the streets for one day and see how people treat them and the affect on their dignity.

[0]: I've actually volunteered at a soup kitchen (not the same thing as a shelter, I know) for a time and spoken to many of the people there. Many are just single parents, older/infirm people, struggling immigrants, and many just recently lost their jobs. (One was even a former college professor) There was one time when a very drunk person had to be denied, but that was a rare occurrence.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#108

Post by datalus »

toxican wrote: post #38
anoonmoose wrote: post #12

>> "Move over Martin Shkreli. You now have competition for the title of America’s most reviled millennial." That seems unfair. Shkreli made the news for doing things that would have a tangible effect on peoples lives, and doing those things with a smile. Let's compare Shkreli raising the prices on life-saving drugs to the first paragraph of Keller's blog post: >> "I am writing today, to voice my concern and outrage o…

Also, what on earth are the limits for a millennial? My late-20s self, a 9th grader and a man in his 30s should not all be classified the same...

When you consider that people physically age at different rates generation cutoffs make even less sense.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#109

Post by StavrosK »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #93
wlesieutre wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> sleep in the cold Are we talking about the same city here? I'd call SF "occasionally chilly" at best. That's part of why so many homeless people gravitate to CA; if you're sleeping outdoors there are many, many worse climates for it. > The coldest day of the year is December 26, with an average low of 44°F and high of 55°F. https://weatherspark.com/averages/31587/San-Francisco-Califo... Related: did you know that w…

...and why we have few/no homeless in my town: it stays around 16F for weeks at a time. And goes negative overnight. Also, the Emergency Housing Project, an Ecumenical service my UU Church started 20 years ago.

A solution to the OP's problem presents itself: Make SF colder!

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#110

Post by k-mcgrady »

toxican wrote: post #38
anoonmoose wrote: post #12

>> "Move over Martin Shkreli. You now have competition for the title of America’s most reviled millennial." That seems unfair. Shkreli made the news for doing things that would have a tangible effect on peoples lives, and doing those things with a smile. Let's compare Shkreli raising the prices on life-saving drugs to the first paragraph of Keller's blog post: >> "I am writing today, to voice my concern and outrage o…

Also, what on earth are the limits for a millennial? My late-20s self, a 9th grader and a man in his 30s should not all be classified the same...

Seems to me it should be people who grew up with the internet. So late 90's/early 2000's onwards. As someone who was born in 1990 and had exposure to the world pre-internet it seems like there's a clear divide between my culture/outlook and those who have only ever known a world with internet.
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