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Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

codeup.com

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Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#13
>It’s fairly common for incoming Computer Science majors to ask the question, “Why do I have to learn all this math if I just want to learn to program?”

Well, there's the reason you have a high drop-out rate in CS. People don't know what it is! Computer Science is not a vocational program. Computer Science is not computer programming.

If someone had talked to these kids asking “Why do I have to learn all this math if I just want to learn to program?” and told them "You don't have to learn all this math if you just want to learn to program" before they became CS majors, then they might not have become a CS major in the first place.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#14
post #11

Does a "simple algebra test" correlate with IQ? Does "programming aptitude" (whatever the hell that is meant to be) correlate with IQ? The headline would then follow. I know this is a socially unacceptable opinion but I think those correlations exist.

Codeup CEO here. We actually did some brief testing with classical IQ tests and saw two problems:

1) IQ tests are really long and expensive, so difficult to implement

2) They didn't correlate with performance as well as algebra.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#15
post #11

Does a "simple algebra test" correlate with IQ? Does "programming aptitude" (whatever the hell that is meant to be) correlate with IQ? The headline would then follow. I know this is a socially unacceptable opinion but I think those correlations exist.

Aside from being wrong and indeed often disparaged, this still common attitude has the unfortunate effect of helping to exclude those who can make an excellent contribution to a programming team but who approach programming from a different point of view - for example, I have a friend who's working quite competently in the field and has general block with respect to math but came to programming through music and graphic design.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#16
Most programming jobs involve a lot of algebra. You have variables, you do arithmetic to those variables, you apply functions. It's not a great surprise to me that if you are good at high school algebra, you can probably learn how to program.

You might not be a great programmer, but you'll be able to do it.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#17
post #11

Does a "simple algebra test" correlate with IQ? Does "programming aptitude" (whatever the hell that is meant to be) correlate with IQ? The headline would then follow. I know this is a socially unacceptable opinion but I think those correlations exist.

Codeup CEO here. We actually did some brief testing with classical IQ tests and saw two problems: 1) IQ tests are really long and expensive, so difficult to implement 2) They didn't correlate with performance as well as algebra.

I've read your answer about your methodology of gauging "programming aptitude" and I'm worried it might be susceptible to your judges' biases - it being purely subjective. I'll put more faith in your point number 2 if you come up with a more objective measure.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#18
The scatter plots don't show that strong a correlation.

From the test questions, this isn't an "algebra test". It's a word problem decoding test. That's appropriate to programming, where you have to go from an informal specification of the problem to a formal one.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#19

How is programming aptitude measured and defined?

Codeup CEO here: it's the instructors evaluating the students based on their interactions with then and answering the question: how capable is this person of building quality web applications?

That is so subjective that it should be ignored. I've interviewed people who interviewed very well but in practice they failed at basic computer programming concepts and implementations.

Re: Can a simple algebra test predict programming aptitude?

#20
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Codeup CEO here. We actually did some brief testing with classical IQ tests and saw two problems: 1) IQ tests are really long and expensive, so difficult to implement 2) They didn't correlate with performance as well as algebra.

I've read your answer about your methodology of gauging "programming aptitude" and I'm worried it might be susceptible to your judges' biases - it being purely subjective. I'll put more faith in your point number 2 if you come up with a more objective measure.

Agreed that an objective measurement would be ideal and this is second best.

However, we've had a hard time creating or locating an objective measurement of general programming skill. As demonstrated by the industry's non-use of standardized tests for programming, I don't think anyone else has either.

If you have a lead on something, would love to see it.

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