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What's Going on in Catalonia?

interactius.ara.cat

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Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#11

Post by lottin »

pfortuny wrote: post #3

I am a born Catalonian although living away. Honestly, the page could do with a bit less bias. Also, the big difference with Scotland is the Constitution. All citizens are subject to it and in it the existence of a single state is established quite clearly. Not so for the Scots, rather the opposite. That is why their referendum made sense. Notice that in the same constitution is stipulated that there is no right to c…

Your interpretation of the laws is irrelevant. Interpreting the law is a prerogative of the courts of justice, not of ordinary citizens like you and me.

And even if the referendum was ruled illegal (which so far it hasn't, it's only been "suspended") some people believe that the right of secession is a fundamental right of people regardless of whatever the constitution says.

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#12

Post by lottin »

dotdotdot wrote: post #10

So what's to stop this from happening everywhere in Europe where more affluent regions want to become independent from less well off ones? I don't think that's the way forward, we should be more united not less. Each region can keep their language, culture and traditions.

Only the poor regions should be allowed to become independent?

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#14

Post by pfortuny »

lottin wrote: post #11
pfortuny wrote: post #3

I am a born Catalonian although living away. Honestly, the page could do with a bit less bias. Also, the big difference with Scotland is the Constitution. All citizens are subject to it and in it the existence of a single state is established quite clearly. Not so for the Scots, rather the opposite. That is why their referendum made sense. Notice that in the same constitution is stipulated that there is no right to c…

Your interpretation of the laws is irrelevant. Interpreting the law is a prerogative of the courts of justice, not of ordinary citizens like you and me. And even if the referendum was ruled illegal (which so far it hasn't, it's only been "suspended") some people believe that the right of secession is a fundamental right of people regardless of whatever the constitution says.

"Las decisiones políticas de especial trascendencia podrán ser sometidas a referéndum consultivo de todos los ciudadanos." Art. 92.

As I understand, "todos los ciudadanos" means "all the citizens."

However, my interpretation is obviously irrelevant but I have the same right to an interpretation as anyone. What the court of justices have is POWER (which is the ability to enforce rights and duties). Not the same thing.

And yes, some people believe that. And some do not. The problem with a constitutional state is precisely that it is a difficult problem.

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#16

Post by ahachete »

For all of you that are not in Spain and want a quick understanding of the situation: it's OK if (some) catalans want to be independent. The fact is that the constitution says that this matter belongs to all Spanish. So if Catalonia wants to vote that, it has to be all spaniards to vote in favor or against that. It's against the law that only a part of it decides, withdrawing that right from the rest of the country. It's really that simple.

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#17

Post by daledavies »

qwtel wrote: post #4

A good example of bad "design", that holds aesthetics above everything else. To be fair, it looks really nice. But having scrolled through it twice and being annoyed by the hijacked scrolling and autoplaying video with sound, I still have no idea what this is about.

Strange,on my phone atm and it works perfectly. I was actually quite impressed.

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#18

Post by Oletros »

ahachete wrote: post #16

For all of you that are not in Spain and want a quick understanding of the situation: it's OK if (some) catalans want to be independent. The fact is that the constitution says that this matter belongs to all Spanish. So if Catalonia wants to vote that, it has to be all spaniards to vote in favor or against that. It's against the law that only a part of it decides, withdrawing that right from the rest of the country.…

> The fact is that the constitution says that this matter belongs to all Spanish

No, Spanish constitution say that Spain is indissoluble.

> It's really that simple.

No, it is not that simple

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#19

Post by Oletros »

pyriku wrote: post #5

The situation is not that simple as "Catalonians want to become an independent state": they want to be independent with some conditions. For instance they claim they should not take any part of repaying Spain's debt, but some of part comes from them. Is like if a group of friends go out for dinner and someone say "I'm not paying". They want to keep be part of the EU, which is not that simple, open borders, same curre…

> they want to be independent with some conditions. For instance they claim they should not take any part of repaying Spain's debt, but some of part comes from them.

Source?

Re: What's Going on in Catalonia?

#20

Post by dkbrk »

qwtel wrote: post #4

A good example of bad "design", that holds aesthetics above everything else. To be fair, it looks really nice. But having scrolled through it twice and being annoyed by the hijacked scrolling and autoplaying video with sound, I still have no idea what this is about.

With firefox 33.0.1 on Linux, the scrolling was very jerky. That, and the hijacked scrolling made me give up about halfway through.

Frankly, Wikipedia does a far better job.

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