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Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

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Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#11

Post by yummyfajitas »

idlewords wrote: post #2

I've done a similar thing as this guy, living in a number of countries for half a year or so, usually in connection with language study (doing remote contract work to pay my way). I've also observed American expats in those places, and in my home country (Poland). I think it is laudable to live abroad, and in our field we're fortunate enough to be able to choose where to live. But with that choice I think comes a cer…

* Basically treating it as your private hotel resort. I've seen many people who choose this route, and I find it pretty repugnant.*

I assume that by this, you mean buying cheap food/beer and ignoring local culture? While it isn't my preference, I'm curious why you find it repugnant.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#13

Post by dimarco »

paulgb wrote: post #12

Seems the recruiting problem is a big one -- I wonder if there is a job board specifically for companies that are bootstraping abroad? Maybe there are too few companies doing this to make a job board worthwhile.

I would love to browse a job board of these openings.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#14

Post by patio11 »

idlewords wrote: post #9
alain94040 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is one of very few countries in the world that taxes their citizens who live abroad. So yes, technically you'd be subject to pay income tax in both the US and the country you live in, but it is likely that there is a tax treaty with the host country that will let you deduct any local income taxes paid from your US taxes. In practice, this means that you will pay only one income tax (but file two returns).

You do not have to pay income tax if you spend less than 30 days in the US that calendar year. You do have to pay any self-employment tax, however. The rules are extremely complex and I highly advise consulting someone who understands them.

You do not have to pay income tax if you spend less than 30 days in the US that calendar year.

Careful with tax advice from the Internet, folks. idlewords is talking about passing the Physical Presence Test for the Foreign Earned Income Exemption. If you quality for the FEIE via either the physical presence test or the bona-fide residence test (see the IRS docs, they are fairly easy to understand), you get to exempt the first X of your income from the income tax. X is in the $80k range this year, check your friendly local IRS website.

Regardless of the FEIE, your income is not exempt from self-employment taxes, as idlewords said. Additionally, it has to be EARNED income, a distinction which has VERY IMPORTANT CONSEQUENCES for people here who are intending to sell their startup at some point. To oversimplify, earned income is the portion of your profit you gain in return for services rendered, but it excludes the return on invested capital -- including IP. So if you end up selling your business for $500,000, it is highly likely that large portions of that are not earned income, and will be taxed from the first dollar in the US.

Taxes are a minor headache for me every year, and this year my business gets to start filing with Japan, too. Yaaaaaay, more fun.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#15

Post by jhancock »

wallflower wrote: post #10
idlewords wrote: post #2

I've done a similar thing as this guy, living in a number of countries for half a year or so, usually in connection with language study (doing remote contract work to pay my way). I've also observed American expats in those places, and in my home country (Poland). I think it is laudable to live abroad, and in our field we're fortunate enough to be able to choose where to live. But with that choice I think comes a cer…

> Be respectful of the place, and try to go beyond the role of a self-satisfied expat I'd like to hear you expand on this or is it something that you just learn from experience and actual long-term traveling and not from arm-chair reading articles on a site like http://BraveNewTraveler.com ? Thanks

I can relate to this comment. I've bootstrapped in Shanghai (last 9 years) and in Cape Town (6 months, mid-90s). Both were great. I ran into other Americans and Europeans from time to time that were not respectful of the locals and I felt they set a bad example and muddied the waters for the lot of us.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#16

Post by colinplamondon »

paulgb wrote: post #12

Seems the recruiting problem is a big one -- I wonder if there is a job board specifically for companies that are bootstraping abroad? Maybe there are too few companies doing this to make a job board worthwhile.

It's actually super easy to hire so long as this is something uncommon- our employees will find us.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#17

Post by mr_luc »

colinplamondon wrote: post #8
inaka wrote: post #7

ok, here's what i like and dislike about living in argentina and starting up a consulting business and building a product on the side. first, yes, it's cheaper, and yes, the wine i buy is better 100 fold than the states, and yes, i would say i've cut costs by about 40%. my kids didn't belong to a private club and take swimming and tennis lessons in seattle... so we're not taking advantage of the cost savings we could…

I just pulled up your profile, but alas, no contact info :( Going to Costa Rica next month but I'll be down to South America in January, we should definitely meet up when I'm in town.

I live in Ecuador 9 months out of the year.

If you plan on swinging through Manta, shoot me an email.

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#18

Post by aditya »

This sounds like a bad idea for exactly the same reasons as starting up in a startup hub sounds like a good idea.

1) Easy to find and hire good people from your own network

2) Easy to raise money from connections in your own network

3) Easy to find accountants, lawyers, office space from your own network

Starting a successful business is a fairly complicated and risky thing to do, why would you want to go live somewhere that makes it even harder? (Note: This does not apply if you're the only one building a product and just need a change to focus and get it out.)

Perhaps, starting and selling a business in the valley and then going on your world tour/vision quest is a better idea, no? :-)

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#19

Post by colinplamondon »

mr_luc wrote: post #17
colinplamondon wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just pulled up your profile, but alas, no contact info :( Going to Costa Rica next month but I'll be down to South America in January, we should definitely meet up when I'm in town.

I live in Ecuador 9 months out of the year. If you plan on swinging through Manta, shoot me an email.

No email in your profile, but I'm really interested in your experience in Ecuador- we're planning on heading to Costa Rica at the beginning of next month, but Ecuador might be a way better option. Do you know of any good three bedroom rentals on the coast? Figure we could get 3G cards and be off to the hour a day of surfing races.

copla201 at gmail is my email- hit me back!

Re: Bootstrapping Abroad: why we do it and why it's awesome

#20

Post by paulgb »

colinplamondon wrote: post #16
paulgb wrote: post #12

Seems the recruiting problem is a big one -- I wonder if there is a job board specifically for companies that are bootstraping abroad? Maybe there are too few companies doing this to make a job board worthwhile.

It's actually super easy to hire so long as this is something uncommon- our employees will find us.

Have you needed to expand yet? Do potential employees find you through your blog, or elsewhere? If you're not actively hiring, do you still get a lot of unsolicited resumes from people who are intrigued by the lifestyle?

edit: btw, your personal website gives me a redirect loop (Chromium and FF on linux)

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