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Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

iwilcox.me.uk

11–20 of 79 posts

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#11
post #7

Fractional reserve? I don't like that. It's like building a house of cards or a ponzi scheme. You shouldn't be able to say you have 10x of the value you actually have.

Right? Banks making loans? It's preposterous .

Fractional reserve is sort of a misappropriated term as applied to bitcoin exchanges. Such exchanges aren't making loans, so where would the money be going? There's no good reason for them not to have 100% of the funds in reserve.

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#14

The developer is Gregory Maxwell, aka nullc. Here's a very interesting thread in which he proposes that the bitcoin community should demand that every bitcoin exchange (and every other type of service which can hold bitcoin on your behalf, like webwallets) continually prove that they are not fractional reserve. In other words, proof that if every user of the service simultaneously tries to withdraw all of their bitco…

> The developer is Gregory Maxwell, aka nullc.

This guy seems to be everywhere! He's a prolific Wikipedia contributor (administrator + many thousands of edits), and was also the guy behind the dump of a ton of pre-1923 JSTOR documents to the Pirate Bay, which in part helped pressure JSTOR to un-paywall its old/PD articles (http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2011/07/swartz-supporter-...).

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#15

What bitcoin exchanges do HN readers trust? I've been using http://coinmkt.com I regrettably used MtGox.com. I'm kicking myself now.

If you want to buy coins to use I'd go with Coinbase at least to get started. If you want to day trade Kraken looks really promising if they are supported in your jurisdiction. Bitstamp has a decent track record though their local give me pause. Coinsetter is also pretty well put together if all you want to do is pair trade but you can't do true exchange on there.

I've tried coinmkt but I don't like it. Their fees aren't great their deposit and withdrawal methods are limited and there are fees on deposits and withdrawals at least there were when I gave it a try.

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#16
post #8

This doesn't give you a way to validate your dollar deposits. In other words a dishonest exchange operator could misappropriate your dollar deposits and this scheme wouldn't tell you anything about it.

The hash-tree scheme described here would work equally well for non-Bitcoin currencies, if I'm understanding it correctly. The only thing missing is the ability to prove ownership of the actual funds backing that tree. So what you're really complaining about is that there are no banks that offer digitally-signed attestation of account balances.

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#17
post #7

Fractional reserve? I don't like that. It's like building a house of cards or a ponzi scheme. You shouldn't be able to say you have 10x of the value you actually have.

Right? Banks making loans? It's preposterous .

Full reserve banks are possible. You just have to maturity match everything, meaning every loan of term t has a matching deposit with a maturity of t. Deposits in demand accounts could not be lended.

I have no idea whether this is a good idea or if it would work as a business.

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#18
post #7

Fractional reserve? I don't like that. It's like building a house of cards or a ponzi scheme. You shouldn't be able to say you have 10x of the value you actually have.

Right? Banks making loans? It's preposterous .

Full Reserve banks don't make loans?

Fractional Reserve banks enable you to have your money and be loaned out at the same time(thereby stretching the money supply like an elastic rubber band).

Full Reserve banks ONLY loan out money which was specifically deposited to them for the purposes of being able to be loaned out.

Re: Gmaxwell's “prove how (non)-fractional your Bitcoin reserves are” scheme

#19

Fractional reserve? I don't like that. It's like building a house of cards or a ponzi scheme. You shouldn't be able to say you have 10x of the value you actually have.

Not sure if joking You do realize that modern finance depends on this notion? For example, Banks need no more than 10% of a loan as cash on hand.

> You do realize that modern finance depends on this notion?

Modern finance also causes some very serious societal problems, in my opinion.

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