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Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#11

Post by justin66 »

jasonlotito wrote: post #5
toomuchtodo wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how often does this happen: "Police regret this incident and would like to extend their condolences to the family of the man," Icelandic police chief Haraldur Johannessen told reporters.

All the time? We've just become too cynical to believe it, or pay it much mind.

I don't study every press release by police but it strikes me as an unusual statement.

It's obvious enough why this would be the case. Keep in mind, in America police departments will be financially liable to the dead person's family if they admit an error, anything they say can be used against them in court, and shootings like this happen a lot.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#12

Post by wavefunction »

jasonlotito wrote: post #5
toomuchtodo wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how often does this happen: "Police regret this incident and would like to extend their condolences to the family of the man," Icelandic police chief Haraldur Johannessen told reporters.

All the time? We've just become too cynical to believe it, or pay it much mind.

I have never seen the police in the US apologize for anything.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#14

Post by Loughla »

TillE wrote: post #10
salient wrote: post #6

I could already imagine a joke about American cops sounding something like: - Friend: "Have you heard the news about the Iceland police killing a man for the first time?" - American cop, confused: "What do you mean? The first one today?" It also reminds me of this story: http://www.thewire.com/global/2012/05/german-police-used-onl... German police shot 85 bullets against people in the whole year , while American cops…

A few weeks ago I was reading in a local paper (Berliner Morgenpost, I think) about how the police in Berlin had shot an armed person in the leg, thereby succeeding in arresting him without any further injury. Made me quite happy, because I was reminded of all the Americans who vehemently insist that shoot to kill is the only option ever, even if the person only has a knife.

It's not that shoot to kill is the only option, ever.

It's that center-body-mass is the largest target to shoot at, and therefore the safest to shoot at in a public area. Safest for everyone except the one being shot at, that is.

God, does that make sense? It's hard to explain that. You want the largest part of the bad-guy to catch the bullet, to make sure the people around him don't. Therefore, shooting at the (relatively) stable center of his chest is a heck of a lot easier and safer than shooting at his moving arms or legs.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#15

Post by thoradam »

Pxtl wrote: post #9

"first time someone has been killed in an armed police operation " emphasis mine. As much as Iceland seems like a lovely place, I'm sure officers there have killed people in the line of duty before and it's more just the "armed police operation" that represents the difference.

I don't recall any other incident. By the way the only armed police force in Iceland are the special forces. Regular police officers and agents are not armed.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#18

Post by drcube »

TillE wrote: post #10
salient wrote: post #6

I could already imagine a joke about American cops sounding something like: - Friend: "Have you heard the news about the Iceland police killing a man for the first time?" - American cop, confused: "What do you mean? The first one today?" It also reminds me of this story: http://www.thewire.com/global/2012/05/german-police-used-onl... German police shot 85 bullets against people in the whole year , while American cops…

A few weeks ago I was reading in a local paper (Berliner Morgenpost, I think) about how the police in Berlin had shot an armed person in the leg, thereby succeeding in arresting him without any further injury. Made me quite happy, because I was reminded of all the Americans who vehemently insist that shoot to kill is the only option ever, even if the person only has a knife.

No. Police aren't Annie Oakley. Chances are, they wounded the suspect while trying to kill.

In a life or death situation (which is the only time it is acceptable to shoot a person), nobody has time to make trick shots. If the target deserves to die, aim center mass. If not, don't shoot at all.

Imagine if the cops tried to "shoot to non-fatally disable" someone who didn't deserve to die, but killed him anyway? That would be murder. You don't shoot at anyone if killing them isn't justified.

Then if you miss and shoot the gun out of their hand, or whatever the movies have told you is the easy, humane thing to do, well, that's a bonus. You can breathe easy knowing you didn't end up killing anyone.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#19

Post by rayiner »

For context, the U.S. has about 1,000 times as many people as Iceland, and here police kill about 300-400 people per year.

Moreover, Iceland is a much less violent society to begin with. Apparently the country had just one murder in 2011, which would be equivalent to about 1,000 murders in a country the size of the U.S. In actuality, the U.S. has 14-15,000 murders per year.

A more interesting statistic might be to compute the ratio: police killings divided by total homicides. If Iceland has the same ratio as the U.S., and averages one homicide per year, one would expect about one police killing every ~40 years. If Iceland had the same ratio as NYC (16 police killings in 2012 divided by 414 homicides), one would expect about one police killing every 26 years.

I'm not sure if we have an "ultra-violent" style of policing, or rather just policing consistent with a very violent society.

Re: Icelandic Police kill someone for the first time.

#20

Post by pi-rat »

heydenberk wrote: post #16

Before you extrapolate anything about Iceland to a larger country (say, the United States), remember how tiny it is. http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=the+population+of+icela...

Still, first Police killing ever, pretty impressive that the record held so long, even if they are only 332000.. err.. 331999 people.
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