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Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

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11–20 of 63 posts

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#11
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well thank goodness for that. At least this way there is no chance of recovery. I enjoyed the bit at the end about a potential lawsuit to get the BTC back. Sounds awfully familiar to the legal posturing after some other BTC heists--none of which got anywhere AFAIK. Do people still think the irrevocability of BTC transactions is a good thing?

yes. events like this encourage better security.

If that's true, why did we see three significant Bitcoin services get hacked in basically the same way in the last year? I'm talking about the Linode ones.

Events like this encourage better thieves.

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#12
post #7
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well thank goodness for that. At least this way there is no chance of recovery. I enjoyed the bit at the end about a potential lawsuit to get the BTC back. Sounds awfully familiar to the legal posturing after some other BTC heists--none of which got anywhere AFAIK. Do people still think the irrevocability of BTC transactions is a good thing?

>Do people still think the irrevocability of BTC transactions is a good thing? Yes. Third parties will provide escrow/insurance services if there is demand for them. Transactions been irreversible "by default" is a core benefit of bitcoin and merchants may preffer that over chargebacks at 18€.

Insurance does not eliminate risk from the market.

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#14
post #8
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They seem to be currently worth more than $1 million USD though. Maybe the USD equivalent was chosen for the title because more people would be able to immediately relate to it as a value.

this is common linkbait tactic now. They take the current high trading value of BTC & multiply by the number of BTC involved to get some crazy-high-looking USD price. It's not money in hand, the reality of getting that money out of BTC can be pricey.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if someone tries to convert stolen BTC into USD, it'll show up as a public transaction? (hence making it useless to steal BTC)

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#15
post #10
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is common linkbait tactic now. They take the current high trading value of BTC & multiply by the number of BTC involved to get some crazy-high-looking USD price. It's not money in hand, the reality of getting that money out of BTC can be pricey.

Which is why bitcoin is secure and liquid - great as a utility currency. So you're saying the transaction costs of converting from bitcoin to any useful currency is really high and that we should see the unattractiveness of money-servicing costs as a security-assurance since script-kiddie criminals don't like seeing any portion of their free "money" siphoned away by the money-changers in the temple.

heh they DO hate that ;)

my point was simpler tho which is just that the real numbers being applied to these amounts rely on ecosystem stability and the market cap (a term a trader helpfully pointed me to in order to understand their favorite stat, which these "multiply by exchange rate" figures are an extension of) really doesn't represent the real world value of assets in Bitcoin since the value declines as money is pulled out of the system.

It seems to be anyone's guess as to whether or not it has real value or is a pyramid scheme. There's no way to tell without a mass cashout. Then we'd see how many BTC can get sold off before one starts to incur heavy losses. I think if some of the big players cashed out (early adopters with an inordinate amount of essentially self-printed wealth) the system would destabilize and finally flop. It's why they instead drive the price up & try to trickle units out one by one.

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#16
post #3
post #2

Misleading. 1295 BTC were stolen, no USD.

Well thank goodness for that. At least this way there is no chance of recovery. I enjoyed the bit at the end about a potential lawsuit to get the BTC back. Sounds awfully familiar to the legal posturing after some other BTC heists--none of which got anywhere AFAIK. Do people still think the irrevocability of BTC transactions is a good thing?

Gold, which was easier to track down and confiscate "back" was historically confiscated in much larger quantities by much tougher guys. This "insured" government debt-backed money that you have today is a result of having heavy money that is ultimately owned by someone who is bigger than you.

While Bitcoin is stolen from some exchanges from time to time, it's much more diffused and it's enormously harder to take bitcoins massively from population than gold.

See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

By the way, these "insured" USDs that you have in your account are not owned by you. Try to cash out everything in paper. Or move anywhere at once without asking for permission. Or what would you do when they impose capital controls like in Cyprus or Argentina? Or when your % of total USDs in the economy is going down while Fed is printing more dollars? Or when some new taxation is applied retroactively? Or when some bureaucrat didn't see your tax return papers in time and your entire account is frozen during investigation?

Bitcoin reduces systemic risk like the one present in banking system and shifts the burden on individual users. You can still create a bank if you want, but that's totally optional and you have many other options as well. In the future people will develop hundreds really different devices, services and tricks to store your coins securely. Compare that with monopolised non-innovative heavily regulated banking.

As bitcoins are so cheap to store, security is asymmetrical: it's much harder to take, than to hide. Gold, or any physical commodity, are as hard to protect as to take from you. Hence, most brutal guys end up owning precious metals over the course of the history. Average Joe can only have as much gold as he can hide in his pants.

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#17
post #8
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They seem to be currently worth more than $1 million USD though. Maybe the USD equivalent was chosen for the title because more people would be able to immediately relate to it as a value.

this is common linkbait tactic now. They take the current high trading value of BTC & multiply by the number of BTC involved to get some crazy-high-looking USD price. It's not money in hand, the reality of getting that money out of BTC can be pricey.

Which makes me wonder: now that bitcoin seems to be gaining traction in china and elsewhere, how deep is the market?

How many BTC can you convert in dollars before you crash the market?

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#18
post #12
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Do people still think the irrevocability of BTC transactions is a good thing? Yes. Third parties will provide escrow/insurance services if there is demand for them. Transactions been irreversible "by default" is a core benefit of bitcoin and merchants may preffer that over chargebacks at 18€.

Insurance does not eliminate risk from the market.

Market risk is not related to irreversible transactions, at least i don't see how.

What insurance might solve regarding bitcoin irreversible transactions and thieves is that customers of bitcoin services could have their funds reimbursed after a heist.

Re: Bitcoin Payment Processor BIPS Attacked, Over $1M Stolen

#19
Ugh. There are much better solutions than keeping user funds in the hot wallet (fully cold storage with manual withdrawals, multi-signature wallets), but many "reputable" businesses STILL uses them. I don't understand why. If you want to store your customers funds online, do it the right way, or don't do it at all.
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