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Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

businessweek.com

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Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#11

Post by allritenow »

Article rings true from my perspective as a "level 5" manager in Amazon's fulfillment operation.

Remember that Amazon core value to "have backbone" and "don't be afraid to disagree"? This is where that would bite you in the ass. That Senior Operations Manager you disagreed with that one time in a staff meeting in front of the GM? Yeah, they just sunk your promotion during the OLR because your direct manager didn't want to put their spine out there to get snapped.

Not sure how different it was in Seattle, but in order to get that promotion, you had to tread lightly and make sure everyone thought of you as the perfect little angel.

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#13

Post by oh_sigh »

Ex-amazonian here. Another problem is if your manager doesn't want you to get promoted. For whatever reason, sometimes people don't click, and I've seen the careers of some extremely talented developers be hampered by a bad or non-relationship with their manager. It didn't matter that their entire team, and other teams viewed these people very highly, and sought out their advice and consultation on a number of matters - they still couldn't get promoted unless their manager signs off on it.

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#15

Post by sokoloff »

mrbgty wrote: post #12

Sounds to me like no matter what system is used, the problem is that there's a limited number of promotions/raises to give out. If your employees really are adding value to the company, then why should the promotions/raises be limited?

Because promotions are generally to a new role, and have been perverted at some places to simply be a new title. Want to get promoted from a Developer to a Developer-2? Those are unlimited.

Want to get promoted from a developer-15 to Amazon's CTO? Those are limited.

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#16

Post by pothibo »

Maybe the problem is promotion altogether? Work your ass off for 1 year and then, you may or may not win the promotion lottery. I guess a more flexible style of salary increase could be created?

Work on a project for 3 months. If it attain its goal, everyone on the team receives 0.20% increase. This way you want to make sure your team will succeed.

I'm just thinking outloud here. It could be a rubbish idea.

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#17

Post by gummadi »

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #8
cylinder wrote: post #4

You should almost always avoid working for low-margin businesses. Sure, if they are new and growing, there's an exception, but if their whole growth plan is premised around being low-margin, it's not going to be a great place to work and advance your career. Expenses such as compensation are always on management's radar.

It's pretty well known around Seattle that Amazon pays their employees very well, and has a tendency of giving ridiculous signing bonuses.

That's paid over two years and you usually don't get yearly bonus during that time.

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#18

Post by taude »

oh_sigh wrote: post #13

Ex-amazonian here. Another problem is if your manager doesn't want you to get promoted. For whatever reason, sometimes people don't click, and I've seen the careers of some extremely talented developers be hampered by a bad or non-relationship with their manager. It didn't matter that their entire team, and other teams viewed these people very highly, and sought out their advice and consultation on a number of matter…

I feel this same thing happens at almost all companies I've worked for. I had to leave one of my favorite jobs at a company doing really well because I was never going to get to work on what I wanted, in the group I wanted...

Re: Why It's So Difficult to Climb Amazon's Corporate Ladder

#19

Post by Shivetya »

patmcguire wrote: post #7

"Ambitious employees tend to spend months having lunch and coffee with their boss’s peers to ensure a positive outcome once the topic of their proposed promotion is raised in an OLR." Sounds like all those Microsoft stories that came out a few months ago.

its a trend others and I have seen elsewhere. Far too much a popularity contest, trying to ensure during your daily and weekly routine you don't piss off someone who might be sitting on the review panel.

It has taken getting good work done and placed it second to making sure to not tread on any toes, even if that means things that should be done don't get done.

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