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Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

nytimes.com

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Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#11

Post by venomsnake »

corresation wrote: post #3
jere wrote: post #2

>...Mr. Snowden could stay in Russia only if he agreed to “cease his work aimed at inflicting damage on our American partners.” Mr. Snowden told the gathering of activists that he did not see an obstacle in this condition. “No actions I take or plan are meant to harm the United States,” he said, according to the activists present. “I want the United States to succeed.” A few days ago: >Edward Snowden has withdrawn an…

His transit through Hong Kong did not get him returned to the US, despite many efforts to make that happen, so it doesn't seem to have turned out so badly. Regarding Russia, were Russia going to grant him asylum they would of course want to smooth it to the greatest extent possible, so it's entirely possible the earlier dance was a part of the show (Russia showing itself as a concerned partner, perhaps hoping for som…

The whole thing just showed that Pax Americana is over.

And the damage was made by US government alone. The leaks were small enough to just let the whole thing die down. But by wasting enormous amounts of diplomatic efforts and capital they managed to lose face in front of the whole world.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#12

Post by fixxer »

shrikant wrote: post #10

So Michael McFaul, the US ambassador to Russia, called a member of the human rights delegation today and asked her to pass on to the message to Snowden that he is not considered a whistleblower [1]. This is deliciously ironic timing -- just yesterday, the US Embassy in Russia released a statement condemning the posthumous conviction of tax fraud whistleblower Sergei Magnitsky [2]. [1] https://twitter.com/RyanLizza/st…

I find this administration so infuriating. They are truly living down to my expectations.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#13

Post by fixxer »

jere wrote: post #2

>...Mr. Snowden could stay in Russia only if he agreed to “cease his work aimed at inflicting damage on our American partners.” Mr. Snowden told the gathering of activists that he did not see an obstacle in this condition. “No actions I take or plan are meant to harm the United States,” he said, according to the activists present. “I want the United States to succeed.” A few days ago: >Edward Snowden has withdrawn an…

> I'm getting more and more skeptical of any claims that all of Snowden's actions are part of some brilliant plan.

This is a very dynamic situation. I'm not going to fault the guy for trying, but he is obviously out-gunned. Everyday he avoids U.S. custody is a win. Personally, I think there needs to be greater efforts made at home to protect his status as a whistle blower. The current administration obviously isn't losing their interest in getting him. Perhaps the next one will be different (not holding my breath).

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#14

Post by untog »

mtgx wrote: post #7
jere wrote: post #2

>...Mr. Snowden could stay in Russia only if he agreed to “cease his work aimed at inflicting damage on our American partners.” Mr. Snowden told the gathering of activists that he did not see an obstacle in this condition. “No actions I take or plan are meant to harm the United States,” he said, according to the activists present. “I want the United States to succeed.” A few days ago: >Edward Snowden has withdrawn an…

How do you plan for a situation like this, and expect to know US' every step ahead of time? I assume he didn't expect US would invalidate his passport that quickly, and get stuck in Russia. He wanted to flee to South America (Ecuador, most likely). But then he got stuck and Russia, and now he needs to adapt accordingly. Getting stuck in Russia wasn't in his plan, I believe.

I assume he didn't expect US would invalidate his passport that quickly, and get stuck in Russia.

He should have. In fact, the US were incredibly slow in doing it- they could have stopped him travelling to Russia in the first place.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#15

Post by freehunter »

lettergram wrote: post #5

I don't think I would have the stomach to run. He clearly faces a possible execution if he comes back to the United States, but I think at this point he's garnered enough support from the populous that there would be MASSIVE riots if an execution was passed or even being considered. Plus, personally, I would rather come back to the U.S. and stand for what I did because (1) South America isn't exactly the most healthy…

The US wouldn't need to execute him. Look at Bradley Manning: they could just lock him away in a foreign country until the world forgets about him.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#16

Post by irishcoffee »

shrikant wrote: post #10

So Michael McFaul, the US ambassador to Russia, called a member of the human rights delegation today and asked her to pass on to the message to Snowden that he is not considered a whistleblower [1]. This is deliciously ironic timing -- just yesterday, the US Embassy in Russia released a statement condemning the posthumous conviction of tax fraud whistleblower Sergei Magnitsky [2]. [1] https://twitter.com/RyanLizza/st…

I do not think he is considered a whistle-blower. I think he is considered a traitor.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#17

Post by phaus »

fixxer wrote: post #12
shrikant wrote: post #10

So Michael McFaul, the US ambassador to Russia, called a member of the human rights delegation today and asked her to pass on to the message to Snowden that he is not considered a whistleblower [1]. This is deliciously ironic timing -- just yesterday, the US Embassy in Russia released a statement condemning the posthumous conviction of tax fraud whistleblower Sergei Magnitsky [2]. [1] https://twitter.com/RyanLizza/st…

I find this administration so infuriating. They are truly living down to my expectations.

It's not this administration or the last administration. It's almost all politicians. The next time we have an election, we will get to pick a new one out of a pool of several hundred people who are almost universally just like Obama, Bush, and all the rest.

As a whole, American voters have a really short memory. After 8 years of one party running the country into the ground, they will gladly elect a member of the other party, and then repeat the cycle after another 8 years of the same.

The worst part is that while even a bad plan can achieve marginal success, completely changing course every eight years guarantees failure.

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#18

Post by fixxer »

phaus wrote: post #17
fixxer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this administration so infuriating. They are truly living down to my expectations.

It's not this administration or the last administration. It's almost all politicians. The next time we have an election, we will get to pick a new one out of a pool of several hundred people who are almost universally just like Obama, Bush, and all the rest. As a whole, American voters have a really short memory. After 8 years of one party running the country into the ground, they will gladly elect a member of the ot…

That might be true, but where the hell are all the "Bush is a nazi" idiots now? It strikes me as very quiet on the left... do they not realize Cheney's vision is alive and well in Obama's house?

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#19

Post by JonFish85 »

freehunter wrote: post #15
lettergram wrote: post #5

I don't think I would have the stomach to run. He clearly faces a possible execution if he comes back to the United States, but I think at this point he's garnered enough support from the populous that there would be MASSIVE riots if an execution was passed or even being considered. Plus, personally, I would rather come back to the U.S. and stand for what I did because (1) South America isn't exactly the most healthy…

The US wouldn't need to execute him. Look at Bradley Manning: they could just lock him away in a foreign country until the world forgets about him.

Look, I forget Kansas exists every so often too, but let's not pretend it's a foreign country!

Re: Snowden Is Said to Renew Plea for Asylum in Russia

#20

Post by spiek »

freehunter wrote: post #15
lettergram wrote: post #5

I don't think I would have the stomach to run. He clearly faces a possible execution if he comes back to the United States, but I think at this point he's garnered enough support from the populous that there would be MASSIVE riots if an execution was passed or even being considered. Plus, personally, I would rather come back to the U.S. and stand for what I did because (1) South America isn't exactly the most healthy…

The US wouldn't need to execute him. Look at Bradley Manning: they could just lock him away in a foreign country until the world forgets about him.

I'm confused by this reply: when was Manning locked away in a foreign country? Wasn't he in Fort Meade since his arrest in Iraq? Is there any indication that if convicted by the military tribunal he will be incarcerated in another country?
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