Live data from Hacker News

SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

ef.gy

11–20 of 34 posts

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#11
post #6

tl;dr I'm guilty of the SSD fear. My first Intel (320) drive was meticulously maintained in fear of shortened life span and performance losses. I went so far as to question every file copied to the drive vs. mounting an external HDD. The thing bricked itself due to a firmware bug in less than 12 months. Using a Samsung drive now. I don't think about read/writes anymore. I just use the darn thing.

> The thing bricked itself due to a firmware bug in less than 12 months.

Was it an OCZ, by any chance? The exact same thing happened to me. I scrupulously avoided unnecessary wear, disabled swap (though I've been disabling swap for years), mounted /tmp on a RAM disk, and the accurs't thing killed itself stone dead waking from sleep due to a firmware bug.

I also replaced it with a Samsung, as it happens.

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#12
post #6

tl;dr I'm guilty of the SSD fear. My first Intel (320) drive was meticulously maintained in fear of shortened life span and performance losses. I went so far as to question every file copied to the drive vs. mounting an external HDD. The thing bricked itself due to a firmware bug in less than 12 months. Using a Samsung drive now. I don't think about read/writes anymore. I just use the darn thing.

I don't worry much about my ssd, however I do occasionally look at the wear with smartools.

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#13
post #6

tl;dr I'm guilty of the SSD fear. My first Intel (320) drive was meticulously maintained in fear of shortened life span and performance losses. I went so far as to question every file copied to the drive vs. mounting an external HDD. The thing bricked itself due to a firmware bug in less than 12 months. Using a Samsung drive now. I don't think about read/writes anymore. I just use the darn thing.

> The thing bricked itself due to a firmware bug in less than 12 months. Was it an OCZ, by any chance? The exact same thing happened to me. I scrupulously avoided unnecessary wear, disabled swap (though I've been disabling swap for years), mounted /tmp on a RAM disk, and the accurs't thing killed itself stone dead waking from sleep due to a firmware bug. I also replaced it with a Samsung, as it happens.

> My first Intel (320) drive

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#14
c't has a lang duration test where it became obvious many SSD's were dying long before they should according to the theoretical numbers. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be available for free: https://www.heise.de/artikel-archiv/ct/2012/03/066_SSD-Zerst...

This technology is too dependent on software to make these kind of models even remotely approximate reality.

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#15
post #14

c't has a lang duration test where it became obvious many SSD's were dying long before they should according to the theoretical numbers. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be available for free: https://www.heise.de/artikel-archiv/ct/2012/03/066_SSD-Zerst... This technology is too dependent on software to make these kind of models even remotely approximate reality.

Here's a forum doing write tests on a variety of mlc and slc drives...ongoing:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?271063-SS...

Also, most MLC has between 10k and 1k writes, not 100k. TLC is even worse!

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#16
SSD write fear is kinda nuts, IMO. It's a device subject to wear, tear, and catastrophic failure -- just like HDDs. Keep backups (three for important data; a cloud copy is only one copy), enjoy the performance, and don't sweat it. If you aren't keeping backups, then go ahead and cower under the sheets at night.

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#17
post #5

People go completely irrational about avoiding writes to SSD's, I've seen researchers at an EE dept spending evenings tuning their Windows installations and going as far as stuffing frequently used stuff onto a RAM disk. I guess the early off brand SSD's randomly eating your data didn't help the popular perception (even though that wasn't because of flash wear). But still...

What's wrong with locating frequently used stuff on a RAM disk?

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#18
post #5

People go completely irrational about avoiding writes to SSD's, I've seen researchers at an EE dept spending evenings tuning their Windows installations and going as far as stuffing frequently used stuff onto a RAM disk. I guess the early off brand SSD's randomly eating your data didn't help the popular perception (even though that wasn't because of flash wear). But still...

What's wrong with locating frequently used stuff on a RAM disk?

It's work, but it's unlikely to have any benefit.

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#19

SSD write fear is kinda nuts, IMO. It's a device subject to wear, tear, and catastrophic failure -- just like HDDs. Keep backups (three for important data; a cloud copy is only one copy), enjoy the performance, and don't sweat it. If you aren't keeping backups, then go ahead and cower under the sheets at night.

- Smartctl has a media wearout indicator if you want to check. Most likely, you'll check it after months of use, see that you've used like 3% of the write capacity, and then not sweat it.

- Firmware reliability sadly has been an issue. So, yes, keep backups.

- It's fun to check out the ongoing SSD write exhaustion derby here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?271063-SS...

Re: SSD Write Endurance Considered Sufficient

#20
post #10

I've always wondered what these theoretical numbers, which has been quoted since long before consumers could ever afford an SSD, should tell you... They should not, in any way, make you trust your SSD. They are beyond useless. Also, this article assumes no write amplification and assumes perfect wear level algorithms. He/She even throws in usb-thumb drives in the mix, so, how do you know if your thumb drive has a per…

You can use smartctl or equivalent to see the media wear indicator.

But SSD firmware bugs have been a larger problem in practice than wearout, and MWI won't help you with them; keep backups.

Post reply on HN