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The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

cianclarke.com

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Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#11

Post by bd »

martinced wrote: post #9

Can we play 48fps on our computers? I mean: is there a common video format supporting 48fps and a common media player (eg VLC) able to play at 48fps? If so, the following movie would be great: make several types of animations / sequences (both filmed and 3D and, if possible, a mix of both) but... On the left part of the movie you show it at 48fps while on the right part of the movie you show only, say, even frames (h…

If you are on Windows, you can try SmoothVideo Project:

http://www.svp-team.com/

It's just interpolated 60 fps from regular frame rate movies but it works pretty well (it needs decent GPU for high-def videos).

I use it already for quite some time. Once you get pass the initial weirdness there is kinda no way back, 24 fps movies just feel broken.

It's similar to how computer games feel bad on underpowered graphics card, you do notice choppiness of 24 fps and it is pretty distracting.

BTW I did see Hobbit in 48 fps and it just felt "normal". So I suppose most of people complaining about 48 fps Hobbit just didn't get used to high frame rates yet (I expect for many it was their first experience). For me it took me few weeks for "soap opera effect" to wear off.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#12

Post by KwanEsq »

Fargren wrote: post #10

Ok, has anyone tried selecting the text on that blog? The effect made me feel as though I was drunk. Why does it do that?

Because for some reason they have applied a text-shadow effect with a colour of #fff (white). So normally it is invisible against the also white background, but once you select you put the selection colour behind it causing the shadow to show up.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#14

Post by stephengillie »

bd wrote: post #11
martinced wrote: post #9

Can we play 48fps on our computers? I mean: is there a common video format supporting 48fps and a common media player (eg VLC) able to play at 48fps? If so, the following movie would be great: make several types of animations / sequences (both filmed and 3D and, if possible, a mix of both) but... On the left part of the movie you show it at 48fps while on the right part of the movie you show only, say, even frames (h…

If you are on Windows, you can try SmoothVideo Project: http://www.svp-team.com/ It's just interpolated 60 fps from regular frame rate movies but it works pretty well (it needs decent GPU for high-def videos). I use it already for quite some time. Once you get pass the initial weirdness there is kinda no way back, 24 fps movies just feel broken. It's similar to how computer games feel bad on underpowered graphics car…

I haven't seen it yet, but the flicker of the movie is very distracting to me. Especially on bright scenes, like face-closeups. Then I can see the entire screen flicker, and I get headaches like it's 1998 again with the 60hz CRT.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#15

Post by sliverstorm »

w1ntermute wrote: post #8

For those interested in an in-depth look at 48 fps in The Hobbit from an artistic viewpoint, here are two good blog posts discussing its effect on filmmaking: http://www.theverge.com/2012/12/18/3780274/48-fps-how-we-acc... http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2012/12/19/the-hobbit-an-unex... I've read the first article so far, which suggests that solving problems with 48 fps present in The Hobbit is simply a matter of modi…

I'm curious how HFR with no 3D would have fared. Most of his complaints about the 3D HFR showing align more with my experiences with 3D than anything else.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#16

Post by michaelfeathers »

I wonder whether the problems that people are seeing with 48fps are genre specific? Sure, we've conditioned ourselves to dreamy visuals created by lower frame rates, but losing that might affect fantasy more (particularly when special effects can't be masked as well), and drama where a "cinematic" feel is expected. Maybe 48fps would feel perfectly natural in a comedy or a situational horror film?

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#17

Post by acgourley »

aidenn0 wrote: post #5
ggchappell wrote: post #2

Isn't the ordering of the Hobbit scenes on the graph backwards? The unfamiliar scenes ("orc-filled battlefields ...") are more acceptable because they are less like the real life we know & love than the familiar ones ("... a character standing in the doorway"). So they are on the less realistic (left) side of the Uncanny Valley, not the more realistic (right) side. Other than that, I think your argument works.

I think the argument is that the valley is further left on unfamiliar scenes, as "can just barely tell it's wrong" is more wrong for those things that stuff we know really well. Alternatively you could say "Orcs are unreal, so there isn't an uncanny valley at all for them"

The orcs were mostly CG, I think that has more to do with it. If they were people in makeup and masks, I suspect they still would have felt uncanny. In fact, the orcs in the large battlefield towards the beginning were mostly costumed, and felt uncanny, while the band of orcs later were CG, and felt OK.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#18

Post by andrewflnr »

michaelfeathers wrote: post #16

I wonder whether the problems that people are seeing with 48fps are genre specific? Sure, we've conditioned ourselves to dreamy visuals created by lower frame rates, but losing that might affect fantasy more (particularly when special effects can't be masked as well), and drama where a "cinematic" feel is expected. Maybe 48fps would feel perfectly natural in a comedy or a situational horror film?

I'm thinking action movies will benefit. Comedy, less so; depending on the type you might not want it too realistic.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#19

Post by mminer »

michaelfeathers wrote: post #16

I wonder whether the problems that people are seeing with 48fps are genre specific? Sure, we've conditioned ourselves to dreamy visuals created by lower frame rates, but losing that might affect fantasy more (particularly when special effects can't be masked as well), and drama where a "cinematic" feel is expected. Maybe 48fps would feel perfectly natural in a comedy or a situational horror film?

I predict that a film's frame rate will become simply another choice for the cinematographer to make. Just like different film stocks and processing techniques are employed for different genres (e.g. bleach bypass in war movies), perhaps the FPS will indeed become genre-specific like you suggest. Debate about whether 48 is superior to 24 is misplaced -- it's an aesthetic choice, and the fluid movement that comes with additional frames works well in some scenarios but not in others. Many shots in The Hobbit looked terrible, perhaps demonstrating that 48 is not the ideal frame rate for an epic fantasy, but for some films it would be quite suitable.

Re: The Hobbit, the Uncanny Valley, and what it means for 3D

#20

Post by siculars »

I actually saw The Hobbit thrice. In IMAX 3D, "Real-3D", and HFR 3D. I do have to say that you can tell the difference when watching in HFR. It felt as if the video was fluid or even slightly fast forward. Like you are moving a bit faster than you should be. Strange, but clearly the future of motion picture.
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