Earlier quoted context omitted.
I like Play framework as an statically typed alternative, doesn't have most of the things we like less about Java, feels like RoR / Django, but is still statically typed (and supports Scala which I think is much more fun than Java once you get passed the "Scala is complicated" myth)
Scala may be "more fun", but, personally, I still have reservations about it being used in-the-large and I think calling the observation that Scala is, yes, complicated a "myth" is unnecessarily dismissive. You may not find it as such, but the language's kitchen-sink approach to features does have its drawbacks; I find that part of it manageable but that doesn't mean it's not complicated, it means I can deal with it.…
What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
11–20 of 29 posts
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#12I tend to think everyone is writing web Python or Ruby servers backed with some NoSQL database, that expose a RESTful interface to a fancy HTML5 client that leverages some cool JS framework. At my workplace, we have this debate going on about what to do with our GUIs (that are used only internally). The alternatives are 1) keep them in Java Swing, 2) progressively rewrite components in Java FX 2, 3) go web. These are…
This way you can swap over your existing java apps to one of those fancy HTML5 clients you're talking about. ;)
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#13Earlier quoted context omitted.
Scala may be "more fun", but, personally, I still have reservations about it being used in-the-large and I think calling the observation that Scala is, yes, complicated a "myth" is unnecessarily dismissive. You may not find it as such, but the language's kitchen-sink approach to features does have its drawbacks; I find that part of it manageable but that doesn't mean it's not complicated, it means I can deal with it.…
I don't think its dismissive, The truth is Scala is _not_ complicated. People can do complicated things with it, but in general the language poses no real barrier to entry. Now the second point you bring up is more of an issue that I run into at times as well. Where I find a solution to a problem that presents itsself as the "Scala" way of doing something, and After i close my browser and go home for the day I forget…
Scala is still very nice, but you need to exercise very heavy restraint so you don't end up with write-only code. (Java, and every other language, does admittedly have the same problem: I've seen Java code made up of so many levels of interfaces that tracking down what it does is almost impossible. Obfuscated C/C++ is a true terror. Ruby can get very nasty if you go 'off the rails'. etc etc.)
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#14Earlier quoted context omitted.
I like Play framework as an statically typed alternative, doesn't have most of the things we like less about Java, feels like RoR / Django, but is still statically typed (and supports Scala which I think is much more fun than Java once you get passed the "Scala is complicated" myth)
Scala may be "more fun", but, personally, I still have reservations about it being used in-the-large and I think calling the observation that Scala is, yes, complicated a "myth" is unnecessarily dismissive. You may not find it as such, but the language's kitchen-sink approach to features does have its drawbacks; I find that part of it manageable but that doesn't mean it's not complicated, it means I can deal with it.…
I don't find the language to be a kitchen-sink at all. It is a fusion of OO and FP, and so would reasonably be expected to support features from each of those paradigms. And it does so quite nicely. It is very well designed for this purpose. However it does provide facilities that allows the libraries to become arguably complicated, especially if you are not used to them. But being unfamiliar with a library's API is not really the same thing as the language being unreadable or obfuscated.
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#15I tend to think everyone is writing web Python or Ruby servers backed with some NoSQL database, that expose a RESTful interface to a fancy HTML5 client that leverages some cool JS framework. At my workplace, we have this debate going on about what to do with our GUIs (that are used only internally). The alternatives are 1) keep them in Java Swing, 2) progressively rewrite components in Java FX 2, 3) go web. These are…
I'd recommend taking a look at GWT - it is pretty much for your exact situation and works very well for that. You will still need to convert from Swing to HTML elements, but if you have done any sort of separation between UI logic and Swing itself, this is usually not too bad. This way you can swap over your existing java apps to one of those fancy HTML5 clients you're talking about. ;)
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#16I tend to think everyone is writing web Python or Ruby servers backed with some NoSQL database, that expose a RESTful interface to a fancy HTML5 client that leverages some cool JS framework. At my workplace, we have this debate going on about what to do with our GUIs (that are used only internally). The alternatives are 1) keep them in Java Swing, 2) progressively rewrite components in Java FX 2, 3) go web. These are…
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#17I worked on a bigger JavaEE project with serverlets and all the other things... after doeing things like: "someurl".toURI.toURL; to get a valid url and some other stuff that i really dont wanne start with... I just refuse do code something for the web with Java and Servlets and RMI or Beans or Java Technologie X... now i code in Javascript and ruby and iam so much happier as a developer :)
Java EE is extremely powerful if you can wield its power, and obviously a good understanding of object oriented programming and design patterns is critical in order to make systems that are rock stable, safe (container managed transactions comes to mind) and scalability.
I think you'll see my point once you start working on larger problems. It's not random that many really big enterprise projects (such as banking software) are based around Java EE, and not Ruby on Rails.
Note that I am not trying to be overly negative - it's just that I see this kind of argument all the time, usually from people with no real enterprise experience.
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#18I tend to think everyone is writing web Python or Ruby servers backed with some NoSQL database, that expose a RESTful interface to a fancy HTML5 client that leverages some cool JS framework. At my workplace, we have this debate going on about what to do with our GUIs (that are used only internally). The alternatives are 1) keep them in Java Swing, 2) progressively rewrite components in Java FX 2, 3) go web. These are…
The question should be "why do you want to go away from java swing ?" What are the problems/limitations you encounter ? If there's no serious reasons to change, why change ? (well, there's the fun to rewrite all, the fun to learn technologies, but from a business standpoint, that's not reasonable)
Also, the size of the developer community in the Java/Swing world versus that in web technologies is not even comparable when it comes to sharing knowledge and open-source components. (I work for a lab, so many open-source licenses are compatible for us.)
And, sure... it would be so much fun!
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#19Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd recommend taking a look at GWT - it is pretty much for your exact situation and works very well for that. You will still need to convert from Swing to HTML elements, but if you have done any sort of separation between UI logic and Swing itself, this is usually not too bad. This way you can swap over your existing java apps to one of those fancy HTML5 clients you're talking about. ;)
I would advise against GWT, after two separate projects - it starts off simple, but then as the project grows the more you regret basing everything around GWT in the first place. This guy will definitely not save time doing it the way you suggested.
So "definitely not save time" seems a bit harsh? Maybe worded "if you have anything like my experience, you will definitely not save time"?
EDIT: What part of GWT caused you issues btw? Maybe my uses never hit on the trouble parts.
Re: What's new in Servlet 3.1? - Java EE 7 moving forward
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think its dismissive, The truth is Scala is _not_ complicated. People can do complicated things with it, but in general the language poses no real barrier to entry. Now the second point you bring up is more of an issue that I run into at times as well. Where I find a solution to a problem that presents itsself as the "Scala" way of doing something, and After i close my browser and go home for the day I forget…
That's good for small teams/individual developers, but it really does become a nightmare in 5 years time. How do we know this? Go ask anybody who has had to maintain any kind of Perl code. Scala is still very nice, but you need to exercise very heavy restraint so you don't end up with write-only code. (Java, and every other language, does admittedly have the same problem: I've seen Java code made up of so many levels…