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AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

nytimes.com

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Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#11

Post by eth0up »

lrvick wrote: post #2

It is not one angry person shutting down the internet or a massive supply chain attack that worries most as a security researcher. I have come to accept such things are way too easy, and therefore likely, but as a species we will survive without Instagram. But what actually worries me most is biosecurity. Someone angry at the world with the $800 of CRISPR gene editing equipment at home and an AI model coaching them t…

Thanks for having the courage to write this. Remember, the YouTube sensation, who made a Covid vaccine in his kitchen?

Your concerns are grievously undermined.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#12

Post by lrvick »

sudosysgen wrote: post #8
lrvick wrote: post #2

It is not one angry person shutting down the internet or a massive supply chain attack that worries most as a security researcher. I have come to accept such things are way too easy, and therefore likely, but as a species we will survive without Instagram. But what actually worries me most is biosecurity. Someone angry at the world with the $800 of CRISPR gene editing equipment at home and an AI model coaching them t…

The genetic sequence for smallpox is publicly available. The bottleneck in causing maximum harm is that you need a large, expensive, well stocked lab and a lot of expertise. LLMs helping people generate a sequence just isn't the bottleneck to bioterrorism, it's entirely about abilities and equipment to deal with the physical world. It's still worth thinking about it, of course, but by far the way to mitigate risks ar…

I would note that we already have groups of hobbyists in the bay area using CRISPr kits to genetically alter frogs, dogs, and in some cases human DNA at home, and even making MNRNA vaccines at home or community labs.

I think underestimating how much more accessible this tech is to randos very recently is a mistake.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#13

Post by sudosysgen »

lrvick wrote: post #12
sudosysgen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The genetic sequence for smallpox is publicly available. The bottleneck in causing maximum harm is that you need a large, expensive, well stocked lab and a lot of expertise. LLMs helping people generate a sequence just isn't the bottleneck to bioterrorism, it's entirely about abilities and equipment to deal with the physical world. It's still worth thinking about it, of course, but by far the way to mitigate risks ar…

I would note that we already have groups of hobbyists in the bay area using CRISPr kits to genetically alter frogs, dogs, and in some cases human DNA at home, and even making MNRNA vaccines at home or community labs. I think underestimating how much more accessible this tech is to randos very recently is a mistake.

I am aware, I personally knew someone who did so a decade ago. This is very different from synthesizing and culturing a virus from a sequence. Also, you wouldn't use CRISPR for this, you'd make a plasmid.

The best defense for these is upstream, so that the plasmid provider refuses to make it for you if it looks like a pathogen or you're not affiliated.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#14

Post by pseudohadamard »

sudosysgen wrote: post #8
lrvick wrote: post #2

It is not one angry person shutting down the internet or a massive supply chain attack that worries most as a security researcher. I have come to accept such things are way too easy, and therefore likely, but as a species we will survive without Instagram. But what actually worries me most is biosecurity. Someone angry at the world with the $800 of CRISPR gene editing equipment at home and an AI model coaching them t…

The genetic sequence for smallpox is publicly available. The bottleneck in causing maximum harm is that you need a large, expensive, well stocked lab and a lot of expertise. LLMs helping people generate a sequence just isn't the bottleneck to bioterrorism, it's entirely about abilities and equipment to deal with the physical world. It's still worth thinking about it, of course, but by far the way to mitigate risks ar…

It's like nuclear weapons. Ask any nuclear physicist and they'll tell you in great detail (I mean really great detail, lots and lots and lots of detail, using common everyday phrases like "perfectly ordinary sodium iodide gamma ray spectrometer" - that really happened) how to build your own fission bomb.

After that it's just a small matter of engineering.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#15

Post by cyanydeez »

great_tankard wrote: post #7

This is an absurdly irresponsible way to report this work. Doesn't think to mention that they're working with phage (viruses that infect bacteria, NOT humans) until halfway down the story.

and the operative word "created" would, back before we all turned paranoid schizos because journalists, billionaires and far right hate mongers _are out to get us_, would be "hypothesized"

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#16

Post by lrvick »

eth0up wrote: post #11
lrvick wrote: post #2

It is not one angry person shutting down the internet or a massive supply chain attack that worries most as a security researcher. I have come to accept such things are way too easy, and therefore likely, but as a species we will survive without Instagram. But what actually worries me most is biosecurity. Someone angry at the world with the $800 of CRISPR gene editing equipment at home and an AI model coaching them t…

Thanks for having the courage to write this. Remember, the YouTube sensation, who made a Covid vaccine in his kitchen? Your concerns are grievously undermined.

Imagine an evil version of this person: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jo_Zayner

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#17

Post by eth0up »

lrvick wrote: post #16
eth0up wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for having the courage to write this. Remember, the YouTube sensation, who made a Covid vaccine in his kitchen? Your concerns are grievously undermined.

Imagine an evil version of this person: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jo_Zayner

Game Over, I reckon. A hundred good versions probably couldn't stop one bad one.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#18

Post by jmpman »

sudosysgen wrote: post #10
jmpman wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I'm pointing out that there are people with access to all of the required equipment today, who are experiencing a schizophrenic break... biology grad students.

Why would they need help from an LLM to design a sequence when there are sequences for many existing highly pathogenic viruses and well understood ways to make them more harmful? Besides, biology grad students rarely or never have access to a lab with zero oversight.

I remember when I was in college reading about some chemistry grad student getting busted for making mdma in the lab. The oversight may be more relaxed than necessary.

Re: AI Just Created Viruses Not Found in Nature

#19

Post by sudosysgen »

jmpman wrote: post #18
sudosysgen wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would they need help from an LLM to design a sequence when there are sequences for many existing highly pathogenic viruses and well understood ways to make them more harmful? Besides, biology grad students rarely or never have access to a lab with zero oversight.

I remember when I was in college reading about some chemistry grad student getting busted for making mdma in the lab. The oversight may be more relaxed than necessary.

MDMA is far, far easier to make than a virus from nothing. People can make it in their basement.
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