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The Potomac River Midair Collision

admiralcloudberg.medium.com

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Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#11

Post by Jtsummers »

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #10
worik wrote: post #8

I have just finished chapter 2. About congress overriding safety concerns for their personal convenience Air traffic controllers' concerns were shutdown by the FAA because of "politics" I am gobsmacked. Where was the air traffic controllers' union? They could have used industrial action to address the unsafe conditions I am yet to finish the document. I am expecting to see the ATCs and the pilots blamed by the author…

>I am gobsmacked. Where was the air traffic controllers' union? They could have used industrial action to address the unsafe conditions Think about the incentives for a few nanoseconds. If you think a union wouldn't wheel and deal and enter into some handshake agreement to "table this one concern to next year" indefinitely in exchange for something I've got a bridge to sell you. Adding another entity isn't gonna chan…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1981_Professional_Air_Traffic_...

That's the last time there was an ATC strike, 90% were fired and they got none of their demands. Turns out, the people of the US don't care if their air traffic controllers are overworked, understaffed, and chronically exhausted. They just want to (maybe) get to their destinations.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#13

Post by anonymousiam »

worik wrote: post #8

I have just finished chapter 2. About congress overriding safety concerns for their personal convenience Air traffic controllers' concerns were shutdown by the FAA because of "politics" I am gobsmacked. Where was the air traffic controllers' union? They could have used industrial action to address the unsafe conditions I am yet to finish the document. I am expecting to see the ATCs and the pilots blamed by the author…

Chapter 7 has the juicy details that nobody wants to discuss.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#14

Post by tadfisher »

worik wrote: post #8

I have just finished chapter 2. About congress overriding safety concerns for their personal convenience Air traffic controllers' concerns were shutdown by the FAA because of "politics" I am gobsmacked. Where was the air traffic controllers' union? They could have used industrial action to address the unsafe conditions I am yet to finish the document. I am expecting to see the ATCs and the pilots blamed by the author…

The problem here is not the ATC union failing to enforce safety measures, it's the federal agency whose job that is failing to do their job, and Congress for failing to oversee the organization effectively.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#15

Post by wolvoleo »

bell-cot wrote: post #2

6 submissions, 4 comments, and a combined 24 upvotes so far: https://news.ycombinator.com/from?site=admiralcloudberg.medi... Keep trying, folks. This one is worth it. EDIT: > Note that this is a long article (~3 hour read). If you just want the executive summary of what happened, I might suggest skipping forward to chapter 7 first and then if you want more, go back and read the in-depth analysis of earlier chapters.…

To be fair she's always worth reading it you have an interest in aviation. Always impeccably researched, fair and impartial.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#16

Post by kccqzy »

I spent three and a half hours reading the report. It’s well worth a read. It’s scary; I was aware of the Swiss cheese analogy in aviation safety, so it was scary to read how so many people were raising red flags, but due to either ignorance or politics these red flags were ignored; like people were complaining about the size of holes in the Swiss cheese so much but no real action took place.

The chapter about the rot in the machine made me especially worried. I now have serious doubts about the readiness of our armed forces.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#17

Post by pbgcp2026 »

TL;DR: Because of her position and the difficulty of acquiring experience, Captain Lobach only had 454 total flying hours at the time of the accident, of which 326 were on the UH-60. She had flown only 56 hours in the past year,[1:12] below the already inadequate minimum of 60 for non-line pilots, due to a knee injury that kept her off the flight line for three months in 2024.[41] And in the two months before the accident flight, she had only flown for 4.4 hours,[1:12] in part because she forewent flying duties during the month of December in order to support her White House liaison role.[40:52–53] Taken in total, then, it cannot be said that Lobach was an experienced pilot; in fact, quite the opposite was true. With 454 hours, she would be ineligible to apply for a First Officer position at a commercial airline in the United States, and even in countries where airlines can hire First Officers right out of flight school with 250 hours, she would have been considered a rookie. [Note: To understand the scale: think of Captain Peter "Maverick" Mitchell in the movie.]

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#18

Post by pbgcp2026 »

kccqzy wrote: post #16

I spent three and a half hours reading the report. It’s well worth a read. It’s scary; I was aware of the Swiss cheese analogy in aviation safety, so it was scary to read how so many people were raising red flags, but due to either ignorance or politics these red flags were ignored; like people were complaining about the size of holes in the Swiss cheese so much but no real action took place. The chapter about the ro…

Any major commercial airport approach and landing is high stress work and it must never be handed to unqualified unexperienced people, especially with ADHD. "It's not the plane, it's the pilot". Always.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#19

Post by an_account »

pbgcp2026 wrote: post #17

TL;DR: Because of her position and the difficulty of acquiring experience, Captain Lobach only had 454 total flying hours at the time of the accident, of which 326 were on the UH-60. She had flown only 56 hours in the past year,[1:12] below the already inadequate minimum of 60 for non-line pilots, due to a knee injury that kept her off the flight line for three months in 2024.[41] And in the two months before the acc…

This is a very bad tl;dr and is definitely not the main takeaway of the article.

Edit: to add details, the article explains that the helicopter pilot was flying within the poorly defined helicopter route and within expected altitude on the altimeter. Her instructor was the one who made the critical mistake of saying he had visual on the airplane, when he in fact didn’t not.

Re: The Potomac River Midair Collision

#20

Post by pbgcp2026 »

an_account wrote: post #19
pbgcp2026 wrote: post #17

TL;DR: Because of her position and the difficulty of acquiring experience, Captain Lobach only had 454 total flying hours at the time of the accident, of which 326 were on the UH-60. She had flown only 56 hours in the past year,[1:12] below the already inadequate minimum of 60 for non-line pilots, due to a knee injury that kept her off the flight line for three months in 2024.[41] And in the two months before the acc…

This is a very bad tl;dr and is definitely not the main takeaway of the article. Edit: to add details, the article explains that the helicopter pilot was flying within the poorly defined helicopter route and within expected altitude on the altimeter. Her instructor was the one who made the critical mistake of saying he had visual on the airplane, when he in fact didn’t not.

... "While I was working on this article, a well-known aviation journalist said to me that blaming the Potomac River midair collision on an interaction between complex systems is a copout that allows those responsible for the accident to walk free and prevents corrective actions from being taken." (Also my post was direct quote from the article. I understand what you are trying to do. Because of that people already died and this will be repeated. I have zero tolerance for that BS. You should too.)
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