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I'm betting on ATProto

brittanyellich.com

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Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#11

Post by verdverm »

chokolad wrote: post #8
verdverm wrote: post #2

I bet on ATProto the last year, I've left this year. The network has been shrinking and the Bluesky leadership has been misleading about "user" numbers and hiding that they took private equity money. The atmo fund looks like a bunch of self dealing. I no longer trust any of them. This year, I'm betting less social media as being better and in the long-run a new protocol that learns from the mistakes.

> This year, I'm betting less social media as being better and in the long-run a new protocol that learns from the mistakes. Can you list protocol level mistakes made by ATProto?

Permissioned data is probably the most fundamental, the part I looked most deeply into myself. People want privacy over blasting everything out to the internet for anyone to scrape. The public by default forced upon users is a bad choice. The purported benefits never materialized. Many of the atmo developers have this belief they can skip the network effects, grift the data and social graph for their own use.

Here's the User Intent proposal that is super easy to implement, yet they have been sitting on it since: https://github.com/bluesky-social/atproto/discussions/3617 This would have been at least a middle ground to permissioned data, as would have been personal private data (bsky prefs generalized).

After that money, which I see as less of a protocol thing. A protocol or platform has to enable the people to make way more money than itself, at least 10x. (1) Bluesky should have created subscriptions for their service, they wouldn't have needed the private equity had they. (2) Bluesky did more to block others making money than enable it. Graze was in talks with them to enable the creators using their feed system to make money, until Bluesky walked away. (3) Permissioned data would unlock monetization without blockchain.

Permissioned data is being worked on, but the commentary from Bluesky is not promising. (1) Nobody in ATProto has built a permission system (that I'm aware of) (2) Bluesky are proposing a very simplistic system. This will put burden on app developers and create opposition the credible exit philosophy.

Record history / editing. The former should be at the protocol level, the later on feature that is highly desired, possible today, but they resist with fervor.

Bluesky could have put way more funding into the ecosystem, especially in hindsight with the $100M they picked up just after peak. Now they are struggling and stepping on that ecosystem, re: replacing Graze instead of supporting and integrating them with their latest "ai" stunt.

Compare this to Hytale and what they are doing. Night and day.

The Bluesky team has also made several PR mistakes, upsetting their base, they are really tone deaf. Hope the waffles are tasty!

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#12

Post by charcircuit »

X just unified the feed across languages such that all posts automatically get translated for users. These kinds of innovations are much more important than the ability to be able to switch apps.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#13

Post by verdverm »

throwaway85825 wrote: post #7
phoronixrly wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The reason why Twitter, and Reddit in particular work so well is because of sub-communities that form organically. Which sub-communities are on Twitter right now?

It seems like most of Japan.

Japanese is the second most used language on Bluesky

https://bskycharts.edavis.dev/edavis.dev/bskycharts.edavis.d...

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#14

Post by busterarm »

I am all-in on face to face relationships and no longer investing in the fiction of socializing with people through a screen (or only over the phone). And I've been here since low baud modem days and through every niche internet community and medium you can think of.

Eventually I decided to prioritize my health over everything -- job, friends, extended family, hobbies -- transient relationships with things & people just don't matter any longer. If you want community you have to cultivate it and it isn't real if it isn't deeply intertwined with most of your life.

Also, owning my own copies of things too, from books to music to video tutorials. It either goes ona shelf or in the NAS and gets indexed.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#15

Post by desireco42 »

charcircuit wrote: post #12

X just unified the feed across languages such that all posts automatically get translated for users. These kinds of innovations are much more important than the ability to be able to switch apps.

Absolutely agree, but as technologists our instict is to solve problem as technical, not as social.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#16

Post by verdverm »

phoronixrly wrote: post #6
hresvelgr wrote: post #4

Focusing on protocol and decentralisation is putting the cart before the horse. The reason why Twitter, and Reddit in particular work so well is because of sub-communities that form organically. More importantly, discovery was part of the value in using it. It's why every Mastodon community specific to one niche/subject is not very interesting, people are not one single interest, we follow someone we like for one rea…

> The reason why Twitter, and Reddit in particular work so well is because of sub-communities that form organically. Which sub-communities are on Twitter right now?

Discord is my goto choice for communities now, but I fear that company is not on a great trajectory either. It's like voting, you're picking for the least evil

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#17

Post by _lvbh »

phoronixrly wrote: post #6
hresvelgr wrote: post #4

Focusing on protocol and decentralisation is putting the cart before the horse. The reason why Twitter, and Reddit in particular work so well is because of sub-communities that form organically. More importantly, discovery was part of the value in using it. It's why every Mastodon community specific to one niche/subject is not very interesting, people are not one single interest, we follow someone we like for one rea…

> The reason why Twitter, and Reddit in particular work so well is because of sub-communities that form organically. Which sub-communities are on Twitter right now?

Utaite. Will find barely any anywhere else. Thankfully if you're in one of those sub-communities, you don't ever get recommended anything political or American.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#18

Post by _lvbh »

charcircuit wrote: post #12

X just unified the feed across languages such that all posts automatically get translated for users. These kinds of innovations are much more important than the ability to be able to switch apps.

Did it? Just checked and my feed is still completely untranslated. I have my settings set as English. I hope they don't do the weird YouTube thing of translating things from languages you know into the language you set. Multilingual people exist

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#19

Post by verdverm »

verdverm wrote: post #11
chokolad wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This year, I'm betting less social media as being better and in the long-run a new protocol that learns from the mistakes. Can you list protocol level mistakes made by ATProto?

Permissioned data is probably the most fundamental, the part I looked most deeply into myself. People want privacy over blasting everything out to the internet for anyone to scrape. The public by default forced upon users is a bad choice. The purported benefits never materialized. Many of the atmo developers have this belief they can skip the network effects, grift the data and social graph for their own use. Here's…

The PLC comes up a lot, and I understand the criticism, but it is also good enough for now and on the right trajectory, though the pace could be better, hut like much of the Bluesky development it has molasses in winter vibes. Long-term, multiple identity authorities can exist. Something like Handshake would have been ideal, another great project doomed by poor leadership.

Supporting delete is a good decision in my opinion, and likely a legal requirement. I also like that ATProto stuck a balance between decentralized and user experience. Properly federated systems are unlikely to appeal to the masses, re: blockchain.

Two other well designed parts of ATProto are how the algos and moderation work. Modular, composable, and anyone can participate. This would change with a properly permissioned protocol (zanzibar + macaroons imo) and encourage smaller social instead of big social.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#20

Post by blactuary »

charcircuit wrote: post #12

X just unified the feed across languages such that all posts automatically get translated for users. These kinds of innovations are much more important than the ability to be able to switch apps.

It's a nazi website. Before I left they started allowing people to call me the n-word
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