11–20 of 228 posts
Simple example of how impactful this separation has been for me.
If Wayland doesn't get this solved then I'll just use X11 forever, with coding agents to keep it running if I have to.
super interested to hear more on this. i'm a little thrown, because the Wayland diagram doesn't feel quite right. the compositor does lie between the kernel and the apps, but IIRC the apps have their own graphics buffers from the kernel that they are drawing into directly. the compositor then composites them together. to me, that feels more like the kernel is at the center of the diagram here: the wayland compositor…
>i don't think it has a huge impact on the discussion here. but this is such a key difference versus X, that i think is hugely under-told: Wayland compositors all rely on lots of kernel facilities to do the job, where-as X is basically it's own kernel, has origins where it effectively was the device driver for the gpu, talking to it over pci, and doing just about everything. when people contrast wayland versus X as w…
The fact that Wayland can't just substitute out pluggable WMs without changing a bunch of other unrelated infrastructure is IMO one of the biggest user-facing losses relative to X11. Anybody who is working to improve that is doing god's work as they say.
I don't really get why would it be a good idea to somehow mandate a specific architecture design from the standard.
The fact that Wayland can't just substitute out pluggable WMs without changing a bunch of other unrelated infrastructure is IMO one of the biggest user-facing losses relative to X11. Anybody who is working to improve that is doing god's work as they say.
It's a damper on development of new WMs and DEs, too. I have ideas for my own desktop I'd like to explore at some point, and if I do it'll almost certainly be X11 based initially because it's so much more quick and easy to wrap one's head around and get the iteration loop up and running with. I'm not anti-Wayland and I think X11 has enough issues that it's worth transitioning over to something better but this is a cr…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a damper on development of new WMs and DEs, too. I have ideas for my own desktop I'd like to explore at some point, and if I do it'll almost certainly be X11 based initially because it's so much more quick and easy to wrap one's head around and get the iteration loop up and running with. I'm not anti-Wayland and I think X11 has enough issues that it's worth transitioning over to something better but this is a cr…
How is a WM not just a simple plugin/extension? Find a display server you like and write an extension for it!
The fact that Wayland can't just substitute out pluggable WMs without changing a bunch of other unrelated infrastructure is IMO one of the biggest user-facing losses relative to X11. Anybody who is working to improve that is doing god's work as they say.
Sure, X11 has warts but I can make it do basically anything I want. Wayland seems like it will always have too much friction to ever consider switching.