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Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

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Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#11

Post by jojobas »

Sharlin wrote: post #9
jojobas wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moomins don't depict anything like saving the world, it's a whimsical universe dealing with whimsical non-issues. I can see why Tolkien lovers are upset at these even though I'm not really one of them.

The Hobbit is also a whimsical children's book, and doesn't have anything to do with saving the world (a world that Tolkien had not developed anywhere near the state in we see in LoTR when he wrote The Hobbit almost 20 years earlier).

It was a children's book and probably isn't anymore.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#12

Post by jojobas »

mijoharas wrote: post #10
jojobas wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moomins don't depict anything like saving the world, it's a whimsical universe dealing with whimsical non-issues. I can see why Tolkien lovers are upset at these even though I'm not really one of them.

Somewhat whimsical, yet somewhat grappling with dark undertones, possibly due to the trauma of the war. The moomins starts with a great flood that washes them all away to live in a new place (I think this is a parallel to the Finns moving out of Karelia after the war. I believe this was the largest migration of people that had occured at the time, and it has been described as causing generational trauma to the Finnis…

Fantastic creatures diving to retrieve their pantry supplies or the head of a family grappling with a mild midlife crisis is not exactly on the same scale with a band of warriors reclaiming their homeland and in passing dealing with the eternal evil.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#13

Post by bbddg »

jojobas wrote: post #8
summa_tech wrote: post #4

I... actually really liked these. And yes, sure, they aren't completely obedient to Tolkien's descriptions of the characters, but the atmosphere feels right. But then again, I grew up with the Moomins.

Moomins don't depict anything like saving the world, it's a whimsical universe dealing with whimsical non-issues. I can see why Tolkien lovers are upset at these even though I'm not really one of them.

Comet in moominland is about them learning about a comet heading towards earth that they believe is going to kill them all.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#14

Post by jfengel »

Sharlin wrote: post #9
jojobas wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moomins don't depict anything like saving the world, it's a whimsical universe dealing with whimsical non-issues. I can see why Tolkien lovers are upset at these even though I'm not really one of them.

The Hobbit is also a whimsical children's book, and doesn't have anything to do with saving the world (a world that Tolkien had not developed anywhere near the state in we see in LoTR when he wrote The Hobbit almost 20 years earlier).

The world was pretty well developed, but The Hobbit isn't really set in it. The Hobbit was retconned into his broader Middle-earth as the sequel grew in the telling. He'd been re-writing the material that became The Silmarillion for decades. (And he offered it to the publisher instead of a Hobbit sequel, and they said "what else ya got?)

This despite the fact that some names and elements were re-used. He often cycled the same names around until he found where they fit. Which also makes reading early drafts of the Hobbit fun when Thorin was named Gandalf.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#15

Post by jfengel »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #7
pnathan wrote: post #6

I'd have to see more to have a final thought. As presented, Gollum is badly off, I reckon - missing the books textual description. The flowers are out of line. The dragon scene is wonderful and captures the situation. The dwarves are a bit dopy looking but I think could cohere with the early introduction in the Hobbit.

> As presented, Gollum is badly off, I reckon - missing the books textual description. The flowers are out of line. This is addressed in the article. "Paul Gravett writes in his new book about Tove Jansson: ‘Her Gollum towered monstrously large, to the surprise of Tolkien himself, who realized that he had never clarified Gollum’s size and so amended the second edition to describe him as ‘a small, slimy creature’." We…

Tolkien made significant changes to the Gollum chapter. In the first edition Gollum gives up the ring willingly. The ring was not yet the Ring, and Gollum was not yet a Hobbit.

The man took retcons as an intellectual challenge. Sometimes the retcon itself spun off a whole new story. But it makes The Hobbit really incompatible with its own sequel, even after his changes. (You have to read it as having a very unreliable narrator.)

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#16

Post by kevinpet »

hosaka wrote: post #3

As someone who loved the Moomintroll illustrations I find this both familiar and hilarious. I suppose I might have a different opinion if I'd actually read any of Tolkien's works. > "She even made some of the characters especially tiny to elevate the landscapes." wish there were more examples of this in the images shown in the article.

The article seems to be more of a review of the new book than any attempt to actually discuss the topic.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#18

Post by lich_king »

jojobas wrote: post #12
mijoharas wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somewhat whimsical, yet somewhat grappling with dark undertones, possibly due to the trauma of the war. The moomins starts with a great flood that washes them all away to live in a new place (I think this is a parallel to the Finns moving out of Karelia after the war. I believe this was the largest migration of people that had occured at the time, and it has been described as causing generational trauma to the Finnis…

Fantastic creatures diving to retrieve their pantry supplies or the head of a family grappling with a mild midlife crisis is not exactly on the same scale with a band of warriors reclaiming their homeland and in passing dealing with the eternal evil.

I love that you use "fantastic creatures" to describe the world of Jansson, but "warriors" to describe Tolkien. Last time I checked, it had hobbits, dwarves, elves, talking trees... but none of that fantasy nonsense of Moomintrolls, right?

There are some seriously dark themes in there - and unlike in Tolkien, the protagonists are completely helpless when facing them. No epic battle in which magical eagles and a magical bear show up to save the day.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#19

Post by boomboomsubban »

We're these only used in Sweden? I know I've seen some of them before, but I'm not sure if it's from decades on the internet or my school having a specific thirty year old edition of The Hobbit.

I seem to recall thinking Gollum was big, but honestly could be remembering the Shelov scene. It was long time ago.

Re: Tove Jansson's criticized illustrations of The Hobbit (2023)

#20

Post by hackyhacky »

jojobas wrote: post #11
Sharlin wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Hobbit is also a whimsical children's book, and doesn't have anything to do with saving the world (a world that Tolkien had not developed anywhere near the state in we see in LoTR when he wrote The Hobbit almost 20 years earlier).

It was a children's book and probably isn't anymore.

Was its license rescinded by the International Society of Children's Books? Thanks for letting me know, I'll be sure to tell my child to stop enjoying it.
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