Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

gizmodo.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 62 posts

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#11

Post by wongarsu »

This discovery is thanks to Perseverance having microphones. It's crazy to think about that 2021 was the first time we had working microphones on Mars.

The first Mars Microphone was originally supposed to land in 1999 on the Polar Lander, but that one didn't survive the landing. The next was in 2008 on Phoenix 's Mars Descent Imager, but in integration testing a bug was discovered that made the Descent Imager risky to use, so that was never activated. And on all the rovers since then a microphone wasn't deemed important enough compared to all the other possible payloads

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#12

Post by freehorse »

wongarsu wrote: post #5
verisimi wrote: post #2

[flagged]

I'd assume most French would be happy with "France detected Lightning on Mars" I read the title as equivalent to "Humanity detected Lightning on Mars", which I'm also perfectly happy with

The journalist writing the article starts with

> Scientists analyzed 28 hours of recordings over two Martian years, listening for electrical signals.

Not with

> We analyzed 28 hours of recordings over two Martian years, listening for electrical signals.

Nor

> Humanity analyzed 28 hours of recordings over two Martian years, listening for electrical signals.

Somehow it would be weird to assume that "everybody" put the effort into this, but "we" all reap the success.

On the other hand, this is done with taxpayer money, and even if not, it is done in the context of the whole global economy and we are all interconnected and everybody steps on the shoulders of giants anyway, so, in the grand scale of things, a use of "we" can make sense for everything that happens.

Moreover, OP's argument holds also for the france case anyway.

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#13

Post by thatjoeoverthr »

simgt wrote: post #6
wongarsu wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd assume most French would be happy with "France detected Lightning on Mars" I read the title as equivalent to "Humanity detected Lightning on Mars", which I'm also perfectly happy with

I did not think much of the title before reading the parent comment as I also read "humanity", but now it's the lack of consistency and double standards that annoy me. "France detected Lightning on Mars", fine, let's stop cutting the funding of public research so we can keep on saying we. Also let's title "We released GPT-5", "We landed a rocket on a barge".

Maybe let's extend it to negative things, too. "We crashed a Yugo into a bollard."

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#14

Post by wongarsu »

thatjoeoverthr wrote: post #10
verisimi wrote: post #2

[flagged]

I assume you're downvoted for pedantry (understandable) but it is a real pattern. Whenever it's a space topic it's always "we" or "Japan" or "America". Nobody is so vague on other topics. I suspect it's a throwback to the Cold War space race when the major players did flights in a geopolitical context. If the institute's name is very long, like here, maybe "Scientists detected ..." or "Researchers ..."

Imho it's a quirk due to English's hate for the passive voice. Most languages would just go with "Lightning was detected on Mars". Naming the institute does not add any value to the average reader here, nor does the word "Scientists". "France" adds a bit of value, so that'd be the next best thing after the passive voice

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#15

Post by freehorse »

stavros wrote: post #3
verisimi wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Are you saying you reject the use of "we" for any group that doesn't include you?

I assume it is essentially more about if it includes the author of the article. In the specific case, the author is a journalist not a scientist part of the actual group that did the work, so their "we" seems to forcingly include everybody in the planet, thus also OP here. I dont think OP would have an issue if one of the scientists in this case used "we".

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#18

Post by freehorse »

wongarsu wrote: post #14
thatjoeoverthr wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume you're downvoted for pedantry (understandable) but it is a real pattern. Whenever it's a space topic it's always "we" or "Japan" or "America". Nobody is so vague on other topics. I suspect it's a throwback to the Cold War space race when the major players did flights in a geopolitical context. If the institute's name is very long, like here, maybe "Scientists detected ..." or "Researchers ..."

Imho it's a quirk due to English's hate for the passive voice. Most languages would just go with "Lightning was detected on Mars". Naming the institute does not add any value to the average reader here, nor does the word "Scientists". "France" adds a bit of value, so that'd be the next best thing after the passive voice

Passive voice in english is fine but it does not make for as catchy news articles (as also in other languages).

"Scientists detected lighting on mars" is also just fine.

Re: Detection of triboelectric discharges during dust events on Mars

#20

Post by temp0826 »

Razengan wrote: post #8
stavros wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying you reject the use of "we" for any group that doesn't include you?

It's specially annoying when people use it to latch on to achievements they had no part in. Like Americans today going "We stopped Hitler" etc.

I use it to give credit to peers if I've done something good (and maybe to take/share some blame if I wasn't directly responsible). The one that makes me cringe is people saying us/we when referring to their preferred sportsball team though
Post reply on HN