Earlier quoted context omitted.
Rejoice then, because this will almost certainly be done on carriers powered by nuclear power plants.
But of course! That was sort of my point...
Duh...my bad. It's late :)
Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
11–20 of 85 posts
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#12Extract CO2 and H2 from seawater, react to form hydrocarbons of varying lengths, then refine. Presumably all powered by the nuclear reactors. initial studies predict that jet fuel from seawater would cost in the range of $3 to $6 per gallon to produce
That's a great deal.
Jet Fuel (Kerosene) closed at $3.135/gallon today[1]. And that doesn't include the cost of transporting it from the Gulf Coast to where your Navy needs it.
[1] Sep 28, 2012: http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_pri_spt_s1_d.htm
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#13Very interesting.
Can someone who knows about this stuff comment on whether the energy required to extract the H2 from the water, is more than the energy contained in the chemical bonds of the H2 itself? (assume both sides of the comparison contain equal number of molecules)
I suspect it is.. otherwise they are potentially sitting on a much more important innovation, than mere jet fuel.
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#14[deleted]
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#15Extract CO2 and H2 from seawater, react to form hydrocarbons of varying lengths, then refine. Presumably all powered by the nuclear reactors. initial studies predict that jet fuel from seawater would cost in the range of $3 to $6 per gallon to produce
That is exactly why its such a big deal. Current jet fuel costs over $8/gal delivered. It costs so much because even if it comes out of the refinery at San Diego at $2/gal it has to be loaded into an oiler [1] and then driven out to sea where the carrier task group is. If you're on a nuclear powered aircraft carrier you have plenty of electricity so this is a pretty huge win. Of course an alternative way to make this…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Gerald_R._Ford_(CVN-78) notes that ``Unfortunately the power limitations for the Nimitz class make the installation of the recently developed [Electromagnetic Aircraft Launch System] impossible.'', which seems to indicate that existing nuclear powered aircraft carriers don't always have large amounts of electricity to spare. However, more electricity will be available on future aircraft carriers.
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#16This is a good reason why Tesla cars are folly.
This is why electric vehicles won't work. I'll copy in most of a comment I made a few days back.
Let's say tomorrow some grad student gets fusion going at a very low price. The best way to use this to power cars would be to use it to create a fuel with a high energy density. If you had 'free energy' you'd extract C02 from the atmosphere and turn it into a hydrocarbon.
For more info look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density
and this interview with Nobel Prize winning Physicist Robert Laughlin
http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2010/08/laughlin_on_the.htm....
the key quote is: "The ones that are technically trained get it right away: hydrocarbons, which we burned today have the greatest energy density possible of all fuels. Things that have carbon in them. Will people fly airplanes? Usually people say yes for the same reasons. Well, how are you going to make the airplanes fly? Battery. Batteries are pretty heavy. Oh--you can't have airplanes unless you have hydrocarbon fuels. You could in theory do it with hydrogen, but it's highly dangerous, noxious fuel. Quantum-mechanically, we know the energy content of those fuels is optimal. There will never be anything that beats them." A massive breakthrough in energy density for batteries might be possible but it's unlikely. Huge resources have been put into improving batteries and while they have improved it's not been enough to get near the energy density of hydrocarbons.
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#17R.I.P Stan Meyer
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#18This is a good reason why Tesla cars are folly. This is why electric vehicles won't work. I'll copy in most of a comment I made a few days back. Let's say tomorrow some grad student gets fusion going at a very low price. The best way to use this to power cars would be to use it to create a fuel with a high energy density. If you had 'free energy' you'd extract C02 from the atmosphere and turn it into a hydrocarbon. F…
Most people miss the difference between hydrocarbon fuels as energy source* and as energy carrier. If you make HC fuels from atmospheric or oceanic carbon, you have a nice closed cycle.
(*) Technically fossilised solar energy of course.
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#19Extract CO2 and H2 from seawater, react to form hydrocarbons of varying lengths, then refine. Presumably all powered by the nuclear reactors. initial studies predict that jet fuel from seawater would cost in the range of $3 to $6 per gallon to produce
That is exactly why its such a big deal. Current jet fuel costs over $8/gal delivered. It costs so much because even if it comes out of the refinery at San Diego at $2/gal it has to be loaded into an oiler [1] and then driven out to sea where the carrier task group is. If you're on a nuclear powered aircraft carrier you have plenty of electricity so this is a pretty huge win. Of course an alternative way to make this…
Given the refining steps you'd need after making the hydrocarbon feedstock and the dangers inherent in that process, I'm sure that they'd do this on a separate ship.
Re: Making Jet Fuel From Seawater While at Sea
#20This is a good reason why Tesla cars are folly. This is why electric vehicles won't work. I'll copy in most of a comment I made a few days back. Let's say tomorrow some grad student gets fusion going at a very low price. The best way to use this to power cars would be to use it to create a fuel with a high energy density. If you had 'free energy' you'd extract C02 from the atmosphere and turn it into a hydrocarbon. F…
No.
Electrolysing water to make H2 and extracting CO2 from the environment, and then synthesizing hydrocarbons from them, is extremely energy inefficient.
Sure, theoretically, it can be done, and maybe one day it could even be done efficiently. But Tesla is making battery-electric cars that work today.
The military does not care about efficiency because they have nuclear reactors on their ships and their goal is to not to have to transport liquid fuel.