11–20 of 55 posts
Yikes, I didn't realize Raymond was the kind of guy that posts about "low IQ black people" and sees "Marxists" everywhere. I don't like CoCs either, but ironically guys like him make me think they might be needed after all...
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He wrote The Cathedral and the Bazaar in 1997, an essay about open source software development, and then later a book. He founded the Open Source Initiative (OSI). I wasn't aware of his political views, especially more recent statements he's made such as the linked tweet above/below. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar
Over the last 15 years he seems to have shifted further and further into the MAGA spectrum, increasingly exhibiting outright racist views. It might be age, it might be the evolution of the political debate over there, but the fact is that he's utterly unpresentable now, and I'm surprised anyone still listens to what he's basically just an old racist uncle yelling at everyone.
Eric's suggestion for a CoC: > "If you are more annoying to work with than your contributions justify, you'll be ejected." is not unreasonable (whether written down or not) for an individual's hobby project, but for something run by a company or other organization I think more detail is required. The OSI code of conduct seems too general, perhaps open for different interpretations or potentially selective enforcement…
Good questions are: What purpose does a CoC serve? How does it help?
In most, if not all cases, they are not very helpful beyond, indeed, politics and drama because they turn into a weapon (on the assumption that this wasn't the aim all along).
When a CoC is pushed by a company I think it's probably because companies need company policies for employees for HR and legal reasons. I am not convinced they could explain why that must extend beyond that, and really this is an ass-covering exercise in case things get too "raucous" in the project and produces bad PR.
Simple, well-motivated, well-practiced (I think). Unlike more convoluted CoCs, it’s tightly scoped on work, not fun. Specific labor intended to produce contributions instead of enjoyable social experiences.
I feel a lot more OSS should avoid fun. Fun doesn’t seem to scale, especially when it gets in the way of real work.
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He wrote The Cathedral and the Bazaar in 1997, an essay about open source software development, and then later a book. He founded the Open Source Initiative (OSI). I wasn't aware of his political views, especially more recent statements he's made such as the linked tweet above/below. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar
Earlier quoted context omitted.
He wrote The Cathedral and the Bazaar in 1997, an essay about open source software development, and then later a book. He founded the Open Source Initiative (OSI). I wasn't aware of his political views, especially more recent statements he's made such as the linked tweet above/below. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar
He has always been somewhat on the right of the American political spectrum, mostly rooted there because (people thought) of his maximalist views over the right to own guns. When he (co)started OSI, he was one of the most business-friendly personalities in the FOSS ecosystem. Over the last 15 years he seems to have shifted further and further into the MAGA spectrum, increasingly exhibiting outright racist views. It m…
Eric's suggestion for a CoC: > "If you are more annoying to work with than your contributions justify, you'll be ejected." is not unreasonable (whether written down or not) for an individual's hobby project, but for something run by a company or other organization I think more detail is required. The OSI code of conduct seems too general, perhaps open for different interpretations or potentially selective enforcement…
I'd argue that this is unreasonable for any project large enough to need a CoC at all. What it amounts to is excusing misconduct by project insiders, while allowing them to drive off new users by declaring their behavior 'annoying'. This isn't a code of conduct at all; it's a formalized "old boys club" dynamic.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
He has always been somewhat on the right of the American political spectrum, mostly rooted there because (people thought) of his maximalist views over the right to own guns. When he (co)started OSI, he was one of the most business-friendly personalities in the FOSS ecosystem. Over the last 15 years he seems to have shifted further and further into the MAGA spectrum, increasingly exhibiting outright racist views. It m…
Utterly unpresentable because some don’t like his politics? That’s bizarre.
Some politics are not within the realm of what is considered acceptable.
Eric's suggestion for a CoC: > "If you are more annoying to work with than your contributions justify, you'll be ejected." is not unreasonable (whether written down or not) for an individual's hobby project, but for something run by a company or other organization I think more detail is required. The OSI code of conduct seems too general, perhaps open for different interpretations or potentially selective enforcement…
Everything can be selectively enforced and open to interpretation. Good questions are: What purpose does a CoC serve? How does it help? In most, if not all cases, they are not very helpful beyond, indeed, politics and drama because they turn into a weapon (on the assumption that this wasn't the aim all along). When a CoC is pushed by a company I think it's probably because companies need company policies for employee…
At work I think it has helped since we now have a clear procedure to follow if there's a problem.
Having the Code of Conduct be a public document rather than only an internal one means there are fewer excuses available for not following it — for example someone can't claim they thought it would be OK to ask a developer for sex since we wrote down that that's not OK.
It's also easier to explain in case the problem individual is employed by a paying customer.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Utterly unpresentable because some don’t like his politics? That’s bizarre.
" If you kick out your Jews and replace them with Black women, that's a 25 to 30-point drop in average IQ. In an individual this would be severe brain damage." Some politics are not within the realm of what is considered acceptable.