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Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

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11–20 of 42 posts

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#11
I did back end for a long time. But in last two year I have to get into the front end because I couldn't find good front end guys for the project. It helps me to be better in looking at whole pictures and prevent some mistakes that front end developers made for the the back end and vice versa.

Business wise, it is not good. But for a better understanding of the whole system. I think it is worthy. It is especially good for DIY projects for bootstrap and experiments.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#12
In the ASP.NET community, we catch a lot of flak for the terrible sites that some developers have created with ASP.NET WebForms. That embarrassment is due exactly to developers choosing to hide behind the (leaky) WebForms abstraction and remain ignorant of the markup that their server-side code produces. I'd advise against emulating that failure case.

If you're working on any code that's within one tier of the HTML/CSS, you should have a basic understanding of the HTML/CSS.

That general rule applies to most things. The more understanding you have of adjacent concerns, the better you will be at your own task.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#13
From my experience I would suggest learning html/css coding but finding a creative person to do the actual design (colors, logo, white space, typography etc etc). I really doubt that it's possible to be good at everything - but html/css is 'just' coding - design however is a completely different story.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#14
post #13

From my experience I would suggest learning html/css coding but finding a creative person to do the actual design (colors, logo, white space, typography etc etc). I really doubt that it's possible to be good at everything - but html/css is 'just' coding - design however is a completely different story.

I second that. Learning CSS/HTML is easy for a developer, not a problem. But don't think you can draw, pick color or balance objects on a page in pleasant way. Artistic style can't be taught the same way you learn a language.

If you are like the average geek, you can spend years reading many books on good design and you still will only create ugly, flat, boring sites. Just be aware of your limitations.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#15
So, you are a MC Rails guy without the V. IMO, you really have to learn how to design a simple website with CSS and HTML.

One thing that definitely can help you is to screen shot or bookmark every website that you think that is simple and nice. From those example websites, you can start designing your website.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#17
post #13

From my experience I would suggest learning html/css coding but finding a creative person to do the actual design (colors, logo, white space, typography etc etc). I really doubt that it's possible to be good at everything - but html/css is 'just' coding - design however is a completely different story.

I second that. Learning CSS/HTML is easy for a developer, not a problem. But don't think you can draw, pick color or balance objects on a page in pleasant way. Artistic style can't be taught the same way you learn a language. If you are like the average geek, you can spend years reading many books on good design and you still will only create ugly, flat, boring sites. Just be aware of your limitations.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#18
It depends on what your goal is.

I'm a backend guy who runs an IT department for a top 100 e-commerce site in my day job. Knowing HTML/CSS doesn't do me any practical good there.

For my side projects, I know just enough HTML/CSS to be dangerous. (http://www.almamatersports.com is all programmed by me in a couple hundred hours this year, but has obvious visual bugs on several different browsers, some layout issues, etc, but that didn't stop it from pleasing the guy paying the bills.) For those kinds of things, knowing more at the start of the project would have saved me tons of time and gotten a better looking end result, but wouldn't have changed the clients satisfaction all that much. Then again, the gameplay is so much better this year than last for him that it's not a fair comparison, since for most sites that level of visual bugs would be unacceptable.

When I think about my day job (which is what really pays the bills), in my experience it's much harder to find top-notch back-end developers than it is to find top-notch front end guys. Yes, the very cream of both crops is hard to find, but there's a much larger number of A players in the front-end space, so I'd recommend concentrating and developing your skills on the back-end and just getting a (relatively) tiny bit of exposure to front-end development issues and hiring that expertise out.

Re: Ask HN: Is it worth a back-end developer's time to get into web-design and HTML/CSS

#19
post #6

I'm going to, as someone who cannot code, take the minority view here. You are more valuable to your company or to your clients (if you're doing freelance work) if you know systems administration in and out. Between crowdSPRING + PSD2HTML, you can get a decent implementation of a design relatively cheap. There's no way to outsource "good enough" systems administration.

This is especially good advice if you are in the Java world. Configuration, deployment, and all round administration skills are part of the tool kit that you need even if none of this is your primary responsibility.

I would also add JavaScript and Ajax to the necessary skill set. If you are a freelancer or job hunting, JS, HTML, and CSS increase the number of gigs that you can tackle. Even when the backend is your primary responsibility, you will often be called upon to do a quick fix in the other areas.

Farming out design is good advice, but often the HTML and CSS is not really usable, so you will need to know enough to make it work on your site.

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