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How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

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Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#11
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the dnr has been nore and more effective What is "dnr"? I tried googling, but I just get "do not resuscitate".

Department of natural resources. They monitor hunters, fishing, etc. They've been using deer mannequins for decades to catch poachers and they're getting more sophisticated now with internal heat sources in order to handle poachers with night vision.

Thanks! I figured it was something along those lines, but couldn't find the actual words to go with the acronym.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#12

Hate to say it but poaching deer is a long tradition in Wisconsin. I had a relative on the u of mn Duluth football team and they'd get protein from poached deer. But yes, in the last decades the dnr has been nore and more effective.

If you live in the right area, hunters will give you as much venison as you can freeze. No poaching required.

I have property in NW Wisconsin and this is true. Also bear, which are hunted with dogs in this area. It's hard to understand - it seems a lot of middle-class and higher income people that hunt don't particularly like venison/bear/goose/etc and so they give it away. They just like to kill. (But I like to eat all of those and I have hunted but no longer do because everyone gives me their meat)

But the lower-income people I talk to do hunt for food and get enough meat to last the year.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#13
post #4

Hate to say it but poaching deer is a long tradition in Wisconsin. I had a relative on the u of mn Duluth football team and they'd get protein from poached deer. But yes, in the last decades the dnr has been nore and more effective.

> the dnr has been nore and more effective What is "dnr"? I tried googling, but I just get "do not resuscitate".

It's also important to note that in the US, agencies like DNR (some states have different names for them) have extraordinary police powers that allow them to enter property if they suspect a violation. In similar situations, police officers would be required to get a warrant from a judge, but the DNR can just go in.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#14
The idea that deer need to be protected is hilarious. All around the Midwest (USA) you can see obvious signs of deer overpopulation. Every doe gives birth to twins. The understory in the forest is bare.

This guy is selling 60 deer decoys a year? The DNR is just playing a power game.

If the focus of the article were about poaching an animal that isn’t as common as mice, I would be more sympathetic.

Instead it seems like the focus is on the easiest poaching to catch (because of the massive numbers of infractions), not the greatest impact.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#15

Hate to say it but poaching deer is a long tradition in Wisconsin. I had a relative on the u of mn Duluth football team and they'd get protein from poached deer. But yes, in the last decades the dnr has been nore and more effective.

FWIW, not saying it's right (as a hunter I wouldn't ever do this myself), but most of the biologists that build the population models, inc. the ones that they use to set the amount of hunting licenses or tags sold, build a certain amount of poaching into their models.

It's a particularly hard problem to solve - the hobby is usually spread through traditional means (you do it if your parents did it), and going all the way back in certain communities this was the main way to get meat, even before it became regulated. It's difficult to stop something that not only puts food on the table for your family, but has been done that way for generations.

This was one of the main contributors to the decline of the turkey population in the lower 48. In the early 1900's, a lot of folks thought turkey's were extinct because of over hunting and poaching, and the National Wild Turkey Foundation took efforts to restore the population for hunting.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you live in the right area, hunters will give you as much venison as you can freeze. No poaching required.

I have property in NW Wisconsin and this is true. Also bear, which are hunted with dogs in this area. It's hard to understand - it seems a lot of middle-class and higher income people that hunt don't particularly like venison/bear/goose/etc and so they give it away. They just like to kill. (But I like to eat all of those and I have hunted but no longer do because everyone gives me their meat) But the lower-income peo…

tried both, (not bear of course) thought they tasted nice. Not sure why people wouldn't eat it if its there.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#17
post #14

The idea that deer need to be protected is hilarious. All around the Midwest (USA) you can see obvious signs of deer overpopulation. Every doe gives birth to twins. The understory in the forest is bare. This guy is selling 60 deer decoys a year? The DNR is just playing a power game. If the focus of the article were about poaching an animal that isn’t as common as mice, I would be more sympathetic. Instead it seems li…

Echoing my own comment below, it's important, given the pointlesness of fighting poaching while deer are everywhere, to note that in the US, agencies like DNR (some states have different names for them) have extraordinary police powers that allow them to enter property if they suspect a violation. In similar situations, police officers would be required to get a warrant from a judge, but the DNR can just go in. So, often they use the pretense of poaching to go see what someone is up to on their own land. They even have the right to install hidden cameras on private property without telling the landowner to try to detect violations.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#18
post #15

Hate to say it but poaching deer is a long tradition in Wisconsin. I had a relative on the u of mn Duluth football team and they'd get protein from poached deer. But yes, in the last decades the dnr has been nore and more effective.

FWIW, not saying it's right (as a hunter I wouldn't ever do this myself), but most of the biologists that build the population models, inc. the ones that they use to set the amount of hunting licenses or tags sold, build a certain amount of poaching into their models. It's a particularly hard problem to solve - the hobby is usually spread through traditional means (you do it if your parents did it), and going all the…

> In the early 1900's, a lot of folks thought turkey's were extinct because of over hunting and poaching, and the National Wild Turkey Foundation took efforts to restore the population for hunting.

Well they've definitely recovered in NW Wisconsin. Theyre everywhere and the males won't even move out of the way of cars.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#19
post #14

The idea that deer need to be protected is hilarious. All around the Midwest (USA) you can see obvious signs of deer overpopulation. Every doe gives birth to twins. The understory in the forest is bare. This guy is selling 60 deer decoys a year? The DNR is just playing a power game. If the focus of the article were about poaching an animal that isn’t as common as mice, I would be more sympathetic. Instead it seems li…

I don't know, I'm not there, not my world.

But I would think the goal is to reduce the number of poachers. Poaching being a mind set, a criminal behavior, regardless of that actual animal they're harvesting. If someone is willing to poach deer, perhaps it's a gateway to poaching something more vulnerable. Learning how to avoid the game wardens, building an "underground" community.

Similarly, if the deer are that plentiful (and they no doubt are, there are all sorts of stories about deer populations expanding), then it would seem good policy to encourage hunting. Lower the fees, increase the bag limit, do some outreach with safety training, etc. "No out of state fees to come hunt in Minnesota!" The goal to get poachers out of the fold and into legal hunting.

And, of course, there's "dual use" concepts, as deer can be considered pests in some scenarios (which fall under different guidelines than game animals). That can always blur the lines. So, maybe not everyone running around at night with thermal imagers is, actually, a poacher. Perhaps they're doing pest control. But that's someone who shouldn't mind encounters with game enforcement.

Re: How to Catch a Wily Poacher in a Sting: A Thermal Robotic Deer

#20
post #14

The idea that deer need to be protected is hilarious. All around the Midwest (USA) you can see obvious signs of deer overpopulation. Every doe gives birth to twins. The understory in the forest is bare. This guy is selling 60 deer decoys a year? The DNR is just playing a power game. If the focus of the article were about poaching an animal that isn’t as common as mice, I would be more sympathetic. Instead it seems li…

I don't know, I'm not there, not my world. But I would think the goal is to reduce the number of poachers. Poaching being a mind set, a criminal behavior, regardless of that actual animal they're harvesting. If someone is willing to poach deer, perhaps it's a gateway to poaching something more vulnerable. Learning how to avoid the game wardens, building an "underground" community. Similarly, if the deer are that plen…

This is very sensible. Unfortunately, I'm not aware of any states incentivizing demand. I suppose you could argue that license fees have not gone up at the CPI rate, so this is a discount of sorts. There are small attempts at encouraging kids to signup, but it's surprising how little dynamic control (doe tags, lotteries, etc) there is especially as most states have made the license process fully electronic.
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