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CU Randomness Beacon

random.colorado.edu

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Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#11

Post by svota »

ribcage wrote: post #8

Things like these are absolutely idiotic. Every single computer, be it a laptop or desktop or a phone, are able to produce randomness. Why in the hell would you trust a random website?

Because, firstly, this is a university, not some rando self-hosting, and secondly, you can't generate randomness from any classical computer, only pseudorandomness [0]. This means that a dedicated adversary can potentially work out what the outcome will be. For something like the use cases they mention - jury selection, lottery, etc. - you want actual randomness.

[0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandomness

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#12

Post by ghkbrew »

ribcage wrote: post #8

Things like these are absolutely idiotic. Every single computer, be it a laptop or desktop or a phone, are able to produce randomness. Why in the hell would you trust a random website?

From tfa:

Often, randomness is thought of as something you want to keep hidden, such as when generating passwords or cryptographic keys. However, there are many applications where an independent and public source of randomness is useful. For example, randomizing public audits, selecting candidates for jury duty, or fairly assigning resources through a lottery.

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#14

Post by throw0101d »

svota wrote: post #11
ribcage wrote: post #8

Things like these are absolutely idiotic. Every single computer, be it a laptop or desktop or a phone, are able to produce randomness. Why in the hell would you trust a random website?

Because, firstly, this is a university, not some rando self-hosting, and secondly, you can't generate randomness from any classical computer, only pseudorandomness [0]. This means that a dedicated adversary can potentially work out what the outcome will be. For something like the use cases they mention - jury selection, lottery, etc. - you want actual randomness. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandomness

> […] you can't generate randomness from any classical computer, only pseudorandomness [0].

Back in 1999 Intel used amplified thermal noise from analog circuits on their chips to generate randomness:

* PDF: https://web.archive.org/web/20100714102630/https://www.crypt...

This was further refined and in 2011 they published how RdRand (formerly "Bull Mountain") works:

* https://spectrum.ieee.org/behind-intels-new-randomnumber-gen...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RDRAND

* PDF: https://www.intel.com/content/dam/develop/external/us/en/doc...

So classical computers can generate randomness if you have the right circuits for it.

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#15

Post by lxgr »

zefhous wrote: post #10
CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #3

Ah, another randomness beacon! Although I wish it used the same API as NIST's beacon, either the v1 or v2 API.

Then one could dynamically and randomly choose which randomness beacon to use! I like it.

Ideally you’d use all of them by mixing their outputs together.

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#16

Post by lxgr »

ribcage wrote: post #8

Things like these are absolutely idiotic. Every single computer, be it a laptop or desktop or a phone, are able to produce randomness. Why in the hell would you trust a random website?

Sometimes you need publicly verifiable randomness, and then your own hardware (which you might or might not even trust privately, depending on how much you trust your vendors) isn’t much help.

If you still think that's idiotic, I'm happy to bet against you in an unbiased* coin flip simulated on my machine which you unfortunately can't inspect :)

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#17

Post by jebarker »

eadmund wrote: post #9
CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #3

Ah, another randomness beacon! Although I wish it used the same API as NIST's beacon, either the v1 or v2 API.

NIST v2: https://csrc.nist.gov/projects/interoperable-randomness-beac... NIST v2: https://csrc.nist.gov/projects/interoperable-randomness-beac...

Interestingly NIST also has a large campus in Boulder. Maybe Boulder is the epi-center of randomness??

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#18

Post by treyd »

throw0101d wrote: post #14
svota wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because, firstly, this is a university, not some rando self-hosting, and secondly, you can't generate randomness from any classical computer, only pseudorandomness [0]. This means that a dedicated adversary can potentially work out what the outcome will be. For something like the use cases they mention - jury selection, lottery, etc. - you want actual randomness. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandomness

> […] you can't generate randomness from any classical computer, only pseudorandomness [0]. Back in 1999 Intel used amplified thermal noise from analog circuits on their chips to generate randomness: * PDF: https://web.archive.org/web/20100714102630/https://www.crypt... This was further refined and in 2011 they published how RdRand (formerly "Bull Mountain") works: * https://spectrum.ieee.org/behind-intels-new-random…

> So classical computers can generate randomness if you have the right circuits for it.

That is by definition not a classical computer. It's not a quantum computer, but it's probabilistic in a limited sense.

Re: CU Randomness Beacon

#19

Post by Cshelton »

Sorry, can't help myself! The Ralphie running demo on the site is hilarious. Some say, you could just use Ralphie's actual runs from this past year, true randomness!
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