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East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

davidsun.substack.com

11–20 of 47 posts

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#11
I can't judge whether this is a good paper or not, and I think it's really cool that someone with only a bachelors degree (like myself) can get a paper published without first doing a PhD.

However, the anti-"woke" part of this article seems so odd to me. Given all the wacky "science" from Nazi scientists that "research" differences between races leading to genocide, it seems completely logical to me that you jump through several hoops and make sure your research is really sound before you publish a paper that explores exactly that topic.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#12
post #3

> I enthusiastically applied to various PhD programs, but was unceremoniously rejected, and upon reaching out was met with “…engaging in outdated notions of environmental determinism.” “…you’re playing with fire by suggesting evolved cognitive differences… ” “The political climate on our campus is highly unfavorable for these areas of research.” “…this is probably the worst time in history to be studying such topics.…

Is it? Maybe this is just a terrible paper that reads like 19th century theories about Aryans. Those responses sound like they are pointing to a climate of intellectual repression, but...there's a reason we don't have endowed chairs in phrenology or palmistry or astral projection. And if someone proposed such a thing, the responses might not look too open-minded. As they say, it's good to be open-minded, but not so o…

It's not really a 'climate', but official policy that that area of research is off-limits, to the point that tax-funded genetic datasets are withheld if it is suspected one is doing said research: https://www.city-journal.org/article/dont-even-go-there

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Science has more than just a replication issue. One of many reasons that public trust in institutions has been almost entirely eroded.

Sorry, I don't follow. The man has no track record of previous research and applied to several Ph.D programs; of course he was rejected. Good on him for sticking with his hypothesis far enough to research it thoroughly, write it up, and publish it in a peer-reviewed journal, and now that he has done that work, he might start to turn heads in a Ph.D program. But otherwise, rejection from Ph.D programs after applying w…

It’s a PhD program, not a job and also you are completely ignoring the reasons he was given for his rejection

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Science has more than just a replication issue. One of many reasons that public trust in institutions has been almost entirely eroded.

Sorry, I don't follow. The man has no track record of previous research and applied to several Ph.D programs; of course he was rejected. Good on him for sticking with his hypothesis far enough to research it thoroughly, write it up, and publish it in a peer-reviewed journal, and now that he has done that work, he might start to turn heads in a Ph.D program. But otherwise, rejection from Ph.D programs after applying w…

> The man has no track record of previous research and applied to several Ph.D programs; of course he was rejected.

He was specifically told he was rejected for doing forbidden research. Sure he might have been rejected anyway even if he had been researching something else, but let's not overlook the reasons he was given.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Science has more than just a replication issue. One of many reasons that public trust in institutions has been almost entirely eroded.

Sorry, I don't follow. The man has no track record of previous research and applied to several Ph.D programs; of course he was rejected. Good on him for sticking with his hypothesis far enough to research it thoroughly, write it up, and publish it in a peer-reviewed journal, and now that he has done that work, he might start to turn heads in a Ph.D program. But otherwise, rejection from Ph.D programs after applying w…

If the issue is his credentials why was there so much mention of the topic of research being a problem? Your post seems disingenuous.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#16
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it? Maybe this is just a terrible paper that reads like 19th century theories about Aryans. Those responses sound like they are pointing to a climate of intellectual repression, but...there's a reason we don't have endowed chairs in phrenology or palmistry or astral projection. And if someone proposed such a thing, the responses might not look too open-minded. As they say, it's good to be open-minded, but not so o…

What you're doing by comparing it to phrenology and astral projection is just reductio ad absurdum. It's not controversial that some personality traits might have genetic roots. It's also not controversial that humans who evolved in different regions have slightly different genetics. His research combines the two.

Yeah but ‘racism bad’ and even suggesting that race might have any meaningful impact on anything at all is unacceptable politically, even if obviously true or impossible to disprove.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#17
The claims are poorly substantiated, it’s not enough to make assumptions about something and read about it. You must directly validate a claim by rigorously defining the traits in question, and then find some way to perform measurements—indirect evidence isn’t appropriate to make statements about psychological and personality similarities.

Note that genetic testing or evidence will be insufficient for proving the type of claim this paper is making because there are too many confounding factors which override biological similarities—that’s the whole issue with nature vs. nurture.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#18

> I then wondered, is this mere coincidence, or do extreme cold/polar environments cause this in people? I recalled Russia had gas workers in the Arctic regions and tried to look up papers on it. It led me down a rabbit hole of discovering entire troves of scientific literature from various nations that had polar programs, with tons of data on polar personnel psychology, most conveniently refined into personnel selec…

Culture can persist for millennia.

If it is genetically influenced psychology, it can still be a good predictor of performance in a short term job.

Re: East Asian personality may stem from Ice Age Siberia 20000 yrs ago

#20
I too have read Never in Anger, the ethnography mentioned in this blog post, and the way I found it was by reading a survey of egalitarian societies called Hierarchy in the Forest, by Christopher Boehm. Many of the personality traits that the author seems to think are special about people who share the East Asian phenotype are actually common amongst fiercely egalitarian societies. It is normal to highly police socio-emotional expression and to regard angry tribe members with suspicion. The !Kung San live in a hot climate and are like this. The Montenegro Serbs live in the Balkans, a rather different climate, and are also like this. I finished Hierarchy in the Forest with the strong impression that no member of any modern society could tolerate the lack of personal expression required to suppress any would-be chiefs.

This person could've spent a lot less time going down a rabbit hole with a couple introductory anthropology classes and by asking themselves if there were any societies with these same traits in a warm climate. It is poor scientific reasoning not to check for examples of this personality type in hot climates. Not exactly PhD material.

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