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Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

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Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#11

Post by dralley »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #2

Disappointing that red hat is basically validating open weights as open source, and excusing it by saying this: > The majority of improvements and enhancements to AI models now taking place in the community do not involve access to or manipulation of the original training data. Rather, they are the result of modifications to model weights or a process of fine tuning which can also serve to adjust model performance. W…

It's not exactly practical to hand out the training material given the sheer quantity of data we're talking about.

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#12

Post by stonogo »

dralley wrote: post #11
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #2

Disappointing that red hat is basically validating open weights as open source, and excusing it by saying this: > The majority of improvements and enhancements to AI models now taking place in the community do not involve access to or manipulation of the original training data. Rather, they are the result of modifications to model weights or a process of fine tuning which can also serve to adjust model performance. W…

It's not exactly practical to hand out the training material given the sheer quantity of data we're talking about.

Yeah, no. We can move an arbitrary amount of data around the world at breakneck speed. Netflix does this for a living. It's not practical to hand out the training material because of the massive rampant copyright violations.

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#13

Post by 7qW24A »

dralley wrote: post #10
thrqka wrote: post #4

> We believe that these concepts can have the same impact on artificial intelligence Where the concept is the exploitation of thousands of volunteers while repackaging their work. (I know that RedHat sponsors some people, sometimes to the detriment of projects, but a lot of it is not sponsored, especially when RedHat established itself.)

So, what, is HN against open source now?

More accurate to say that VC and the “startup ideology” has always been at the core of HN - it just so happened that aligned with OSS ideology during the ZIRP era.

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#14

Post by philipkglass »

dralley wrote: post #11
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #2

Disappointing that red hat is basically validating open weights as open source, and excusing it by saying this: > The majority of improvements and enhancements to AI models now taking place in the community do not involve access to or manipulation of the original training data. Rather, they are the result of modifications to model weights or a process of fine tuning which can also serve to adjust model performance. W…

It's not exactly practical to hand out the training material given the sheer quantity of data we're talking about.

But they could provide training code and let people provide their own Common Crawl (or whatever other pile of training data), couldn't they?

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#15

Post by [deleted] »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #2

Disappointing that red hat is basically validating open weights as open source, and excusing it by saying this: > The majority of improvements and enhancements to AI models now taking place in the community do not involve access to or manipulation of the original training data. Rather, they are the result of modifications to model weights or a process of fine tuning which can also serve to adjust model performance. W…

[deleted]

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#16

Post by llm_trw »

stonogo wrote: post #12
dralley wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not exactly practical to hand out the training material given the sheer quantity of data we're talking about.

Yeah, no. We can move an arbitrary amount of data around the world at breakneck speed. Netflix does this for a living. It's not practical to hand out the training material because of the massive rampant copyright violations.

If only we'd figured out a technology that let us move huge torrents of bits around.

If only there was a catchy name for it. Something like bit-torrent perhaps?

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#17

Post by mossTechnician »

stonogo wrote: post #12
dralley wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not exactly practical to hand out the training material given the sheer quantity of data we're talking about.

Yeah, no. We can move an arbitrary amount of data around the world at breakneck speed. Netflix does this for a living. It's not practical to hand out the training material because of the massive rampant copyright violations.

If a research group downloads material in order to train a model, is there some significant difference in copyright violation if they hand it to a second research group in order to fulfill the same purposes?

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#18

Post by Onawa »

mossTechnician wrote: post #17
stonogo wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, no. We can move an arbitrary amount of data around the world at breakneck speed. Netflix does this for a living. It's not practical to hand out the training material because of the massive rampant copyright violations.

If a research group downloads material in order to train a model, is there some significant difference in copyright violation if they hand it to a second research group in order to fulfill the same purposes?

Yes, because of a key word in a lot of copyright laws... "distribution". Using that copyrighted material themselves to train the model still gives them plausible deniability. Handing the copyrighted material to another group starts to run afoul of other laws and also removes the plausible deniability that the original group can claim regarding their training data.

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#19

Post by globalnode »

ysofunny wrote: post #9
jmclnx wrote: post #7

No real information, just a marketing spiel.

i mean... it's IBM so what did we really expect?

I was thinking of trying Fedora (currently using Debian) and this comment made me look up who owns red-hat. ibm now owns red-hat, and apparently vanguard owns a huge chunk of ibm. I wonder how much influence any of the sponsors have over what goes into the os and what direction it takes.

Re: Open source AI: Red Hat's point-of-view

#20

Post by rat87 »

globalnode wrote: post #19
ysofunny wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i mean... it's IBM so what did we really expect?

I was thinking of trying Fedora (currently using Debian) and this comment made me look up who owns red-hat. ibm now owns red-hat, and apparently vanguard owns a huge chunk of ibm. I wonder how much influence any of the sponsors have over what goes into the os and what direction it takes.

Vanguard "owns" a huge chunk of everything. Vanguard runs index funds, most peoples retirements are vanguard buying small shares of an index fund representing all the big companies on the stock exchange
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