Didn't Uber have something similar happen? Ran over a woman in Phoenix?
US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
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Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#12[flagged]
If no one from Boeing is going to jail, Musk certainly isn't either (at least not for anything related to vehicle unsafety).
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#13While at it, please also investigate why it is sometimes impossible to leave a damaged vehicle. This has resulted in people dying more than once:
https://apnews.com/article/car-crash-tesla-france-fire-be8ec...
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#14By now, most people have probably heard that Tesla's attempt at "Full Self Driving" is really anything but --- after a decade of promises. The vehicle owners manual spells this out. As I understand it, the contentious issue is the fact that unlike most others, their attempt works mostly from visual feedback. In low visibility situations, their FSD has limited feedback and is essentially driving blind. It appears that…
Here's a video of FSD driving the same route as a waymo 42% faster with zero interventions. 23 min vs 33. This is my everyday. Enjoy. https://youtu.be/Kswp1DwUAAI?si=rX4L5FhMrPXpGx4V
Can it drive the same route without a human behind the wheel?
Not legally and not according to Tesla either --- because Tesla's FSD is not "Fully Self Driving" --- unlike Waymo.
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#15About damn time NHTSA opened this full scale investigation. Tesla's "autonowashing" has gone on for far too long.
Per Reuters [1] "The probe covers 2016-2024 Model S and X vehicles with the optional system as well as 2017-2024 Model 3, 2020-2024 Model Y, and 2023-2024 Cybertruck vehicles. The preliminary evaluation is the first step before the agency could seek to demand a recall of the vehicles if it believes they pose an unreasonable risk to safety."
Roughly 2.4 million Teslas in question, with "Full Self Driving" software after 4 reported collisions and one fatality.
NHTSA is reviewing the ability of FSD’s engineering controls to "detect and respond appropriately to reduced roadway visibility conditions."
Tesla has, of course, rather two-facedly called its FSD as SAE Level-2 for regulatory purposes, while selling its "full self driving" but also requiring supervision. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
No other company has been so irresponsible to its users, and without a care for any negative externalities imposed on non-consenting road users.
I treat every Tesla driver as a drunk driver, steering away whenever I see them on highways.
[FWIW, yes, I work in automated driving and know a thing or two about automotive safety.]
[1] https://archive.is/20241018151106/https://www.reuters.com/bu...
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#16I would like more details. There are definitely situations where neither a car nor a human could respond quickly enough to a situation on the road.
for example, I recently hit a deer. The dashcam shows that I had less than 100 feet from when the deer became visible due to terrain to impact while driving at 60 mph. Keeping in mind that stopping a car in 100 feet at 60 mph is impossible. Most vehicles need more than triple that without accounting for human reaction time.
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#17While at it, please also investigate why it is sometimes impossible to leave a damaged vehicle. This has resulted in people dying more than once: https://apnews.com/article/car-crash-tesla-france-fire-be8ec...
The why is pretty well understood, no investigation needed. I don't like the design but it's because the doors are electronic and people don't know where the manual release is.
In a panic people go on muscle memory, which is push the useless button. They don't remember to pull the unmarked unobtrusive handle that they may not even know exists.
If it was up to me, sure have your electronic release, but make the manual release a big handle that looks like the ejection handle on a jet (yellow with black stripes, can't miss it).
* Or even better, have the standard door handle mechanically connected to the latch through a spring loaded solenoid that disengages the mechanism. Thus when used under normal conditions it does the thing electronically but the moment power fails the door handle connects to the manual release.
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#18While at it, please also investigate why it is sometimes impossible to leave a damaged vehicle. This has resulted in people dying more than once: https://apnews.com/article/car-crash-tesla-france-fire-be8ec...
The why is pretty well understood, no investigation needed. I don't like the design but it's because the doors are electronic and people don't know where the manual release is. In a panic people go on muscle memory, which is push the useless button. They don't remember to pull the unmarked unobtrusive handle that they may not even know exists. If it was up to me, sure have your electronic release, but make the manual…
There are situations where manual release has not worked
https://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-manually-open-tesla-d...
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#19Didn't Uber have something similar happen? Ran over a woman in Phoenix?
Yes. And Uber immediately shut down the program in the entire state of Arizona, halted all road testing for months, and then soon later eliminated their self driving unit entirely.
Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash
#20I would like more details. There are definitely situations where neither a car nor a human could respond quickly enough to a situation on the road. for example, I recently hit a deer. The dashcam shows that I had less than 100 feet from when the deer became visible due to terrain to impact while driving at 60 mph. Keeping in mind that stopping a car in 100 feet at 60 mph is impossible. Most vehicles need more than tr…
Unfortunately, Tesla requests NHTSA to redact almost all useful information from their crash reports. So it's impossible to get more details.
Here is the public database of all ADAS crashes: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_In...