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A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

nature.com

11–20 of 60 posts

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#11
post #5

The analogies used in this article were a bit weird. Two things I’ve always wondered since I’m not an expert. 1. Obviously, applications must be written to run effectively to distribute the load across the supercomputer. I wonder how often this prevents useful things from being considered to run on the supercomputer. 2. It always seems like getting access to run anything on the supercomputer is very competitive or ev…

My former employer (Pachyderm) was acquired by HPE, who built Frontier (and sells supercomputers in general), and I’ve learned a lot about that area since the acquisition.

One of the main differences between supercomputers and eg a datacenter is that in the former case, application authors do not, as a rule, assume hardware or network issues and engineer around them. A typical supercomputer workload will fail overall if any one of its hundreds or thousands of workers fail. This assumption greatly simplifies the work of writing such software, as error handling is typically one of the biggest, if not the biggest, sources of complexity a distributed system. It makes engineering the hardware much harder, of course, but that’s how HPE makes money.

A second difference is that RDMA (Remote Direct Memory Access—the ability for one computer to access another computer’s memory without going through its CPU. The network card can access memory directly) is standard. This removes all the complexity of an RPC framework from supercomputer workloads. Also, the L1 protocol used has orders of magnitude lower latency than Ethernet, such that it’s often faster to read memory on a remote machine than do any kind of local caching.

The result is that the frameworks for writing these workloads let you more or less call an arbitrary function, run it on a neighbor, and collect the result in roughly the same amount of time it would’ve taken to run it locally.

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#13
post #8
post #5

The analogies used in this article were a bit weird. Two things I’ve always wondered since I’m not an expert. 1. Obviously, applications must be written to run effectively to distribute the load across the supercomputer. I wonder how often this prevents useful things from being considered to run on the supercomputer. 2. It always seems like getting access to run anything on the supercomputer is very competitive or ev…

I feel like the name "supercomputer" is overhyped. It's just many normal x86 machines running Linux and connected with fast network. Here in Finland I think you can use LUMI supercomputer for free. With a condition that the results should be publically available

I think you've used the "just" trap to trivialize something.

I'm surprised that Frontier is free with the same conditions; I expected researchers to need grant money or whatever to fund their time. Neat.

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#14

What's the documentation like for supercomputers? I.e. when a researcher gets approved to use a supercomputer, do they get lots of documentation explaining how to set up and run their program? I got the sense from a physicist buddy that a lot of experimental physics stuff is shared informally and never written down. Or maybe each field has a couple popular frameworks for running simulations, and the Frontier people j…

I know that DOE's supercomputer NERSC has a lot of documentation https://docs.nersc.gov/getting-started/ . Plus they also have weekly events where you can ask any questions about how the code/optimisation etc (I have never attended those, but regularly get emails about those)

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#15
post #8
post #5

The analogies used in this article were a bit weird. Two things I’ve always wondered since I’m not an expert. 1. Obviously, applications must be written to run effectively to distribute the load across the supercomputer. I wonder how often this prevents useful things from being considered to run on the supercomputer. 2. It always seems like getting access to run anything on the supercomputer is very competitive or ev…

I feel like the name "supercomputer" is overhyped. It's just many normal x86 machines running Linux and connected with fast network. Here in Finland I think you can use LUMI supercomputer for free. With a condition that the results should be publically available

In the beginning they were just “Beowulf clusters” compared to “real” supercomputers. Isn’t it always like this, the romantic and exceptional is absorbed by the sheer scale of the practical and common once someone discovers a way to drive the economy at scale? Cars, aircraft, long-distance communications, now perhaps AI? Yet the words may still capture the early romance.

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#16

I have a project on Frontier - happy to answer any questions! Funny story about Bronson Messer (quoted in the article): On my first trip to Oak Ridge we went on a tour of “The Machine”. Afterwards we were hanging out on the observation deck and got introduced to something like 10 people. Everyone at Oak Ridge is just Tom, Bob, etc. No titles or any of that stuff - I’m not sure I’ve ever heard anyone refer to themselv…

> anyone refer to themselves or anyone else as "Doctor".

Reminds me of the t-shirt I had that said, "Ok, Ok, so you've got a PhD. Just don't touch anything."

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#18

What's the documentation like for supercomputers? I.e. when a researcher gets approved to use a supercomputer, do they get lots of documentation explaining how to set up and run their program? I got the sense from a physicist buddy that a lot of experimental physics stuff is shared informally and never written down. Or maybe each field has a couple popular frameworks for running simulations, and the Frontier people j…

Take a look here if you're curious, as an example: https://docs.ncsa.illinois.edu/systems/delta/en/latest/

90% of my interactions are ssh'ing into a login node and running code with SLURM, then downloading the data.

Re: A day in the life of the fastest supercomputer

#20
> With its nearly 38,000 GPUs, Frontier occupies a unique public-sector role in the field of AI research, which is otherwise dominated by industry.

Is it really realistic to assume that this is the "fastest supercomputer"? What are estimated sizes for supercomputers used by OpenAI, Microsoft, Google etc?

Strangely enough, the Nature piece only mentions possible secret military supercomputers, but not ones used by AI companies.

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